Cultured dessert option / THU 2-1-24 / Crown, in Persian / Cured Spanish meat / Like wood prepped for papermaking / Winged mammal with rust-colored fur / Artoo's well-spoken partner / 1957 hit by the Edsels with a nonsense title / Cue preceder

Thursday, February 1, 2024

Constructor: Simeon Seigel

Relative difficulty: Challenging (largely because of the tough fill / theme material mash-up in the middle)


THEME: LOOP-DE-LOOPS (61A: Upside-down parts of a roller coaster ride—represented twice in the answer to each of this puzzle's starred clues) — three answers loop twice, through the parts represented by circles in the grid:

Theme answers:
  • THIS THAT AND THE OTHER (16A: *A little bit of everything)
  • "RAMA LAMA DING DONG" (33A: *1957 hit by the Edsels with a nonsense title)
  • WHEN THE TIME COMES (41A: *"Eventually ...")
Word of the Day: JAMÓN (32D: Cured Spanish meat) —

Jamón (Spanish pronunciation: [xaˈmon], pl. jamones) is a kind of dry-cured ham produced in Spain. It is one of the most globally recognized food items of Spanish cuisine. It is also regularly a component of tapas.

Most jamón is commonly called jamón serrano in Spain.

Jamón is the Spanish word for ham. As such, other ham products produced or consumed in Spanish-speaking countries may also be called by this name. (wikipedia)

• • •

Looks like the kind of thing where you write some code or find some program that will search a database for answers that contain an ABCDAB pattern twice, and then you use whatever turns up to make a grid. I assume this is how it works. How else is anyone landing upon a "1957 hit by the Edsels" (?)!? This is a puzzle that's enamored with form, but not exactly precise about form. Closed circles do not evoke LOOP-DE-LOOPS. And do LOOP-DE-LOOPS actually loop ... down?? I've been on the ones that go up back and around, but *down* back and around? How does that work?  I don't really get the downward loop part, as far as the roller coaster imitation goes. The puzzle crosses NILS and NIHILO right at square one, and it lost me there, fill-wise—that's basically a dupe, what with NIL deriving directly from Latin NIHIL. And it lost me again with the eternally dumb and miserable NOT PC. And then some wordlist animal called a REDBAT (5D: Winged mammal with rust-colored fur). And the horribly forced "?" clue on CROSS ([Sects' symbol?]—why are "sects" Christian, necessarily?). If you're going to make a roller coaster-based puzzle, there should be some kind of ... whoosh. Something that evokes the thrill of shooting through those loops. But "shooting" is the last word I'd use to describe what it felt like to move through those loops. Nothing about the look or feel of the puzzle suggested roller coaster ride. Just not for me, this one. Ambitious, but MESSY as hell, and no fun to solve. 


Brutal for me in the middle, where I had no idea TAJ was Persian (31A: Crown, in Persian) and JAMÓN, yikes, my god, I don't know where I eventually pulled that from (32D: Cured Spanish meat). French, probably—which is to say I got it by analogy with jambon. Forgot the OCHS guy (46A: Adolph who purchased The New York Times in 1896). I wanted HESS, but then remembered that's a Nazi (and his name is actually Rudolf). I had MASALAS early on (38A: Indian spice mixes), but mistrusted it when nothing in that (thematically dense) middle section wanted to come together, so I pulled it. Two foreign foodstuffs packed in there! Oof, and TCBY too??? (27A: Cultured dessert option). Do those still exist? I don't live where they exist. Had the "T" and when TOFUTTI wouldn't fit ... nothing. Didn't know BAL Harbour, Fla., though I'm sure I've heard of it. SAG was the only Harbor that was coming to mind. ASANA are *all* yoga poses, not a "sitting meditation pose," which is LOTUS, so that clue was particularly confusing and awful and wrong. Oh, and the worst obstacle in that center section: I had SETTLE instead of METTLE Absolutely Locked In at 25A: Resolve. So [Brotherly greeting]? No way. Not when you've got it starting with "S." "MY MAN" was among the last answers to fall, because SETTLE-to-METTLE was among the last corrections I made. 


Notes:
  • 13A: Peak of revelation? (SINAI) — Moses, Commandments.
  • 18A: Org. whose initials omit its "E" (for "Explosives") (ATF) — I tend to know initialisms for the initials that *are* there, so this was baffling.
  • 26A: Exposes personal information about online, informally (DOXES) — an unpleasant thing to encounter in a grid. It's sometimes spelled with two "X"s, I think.
  • 40A: Cue preceder (PEE)
     — if you want to PEE in your grid, hey, it's your grid, but could you do it some other way than pretending that anyone writes "Q" that way? Please.
  • 59A: Risk-taker's mantra, in brief (YOLO) — you only live once
  • 37D: Measure of energy savings, as when the meter runs in reverse (NEGAWATT) — my meter does not do that, but if you say so. Funny play on "megawatt," if nothing else.
  • 12D: Gradual transition, in art (SOFT EDGE) — LOL what? I ... transition from what to what? One color to the next? This was the single most baffling answer in the grid. Again, I have to believe a wordlist coughed it up.
  • 49D: Like 20, for Little League (TOO OLD) — So ... [Like 80, for Little League] too? Thanks for the completely arbitrary number, yeesh.
Signed, Rex Parker, King of CrossWorld 

PS The Boswords Winter Wondersolve online crossword tournament will be held THIS WEEKEND, Sunday, Feb. 4, from 1pm to 4:30pm. Boswords does great work and solvers of all levels love their tournaments. Here are the deets:
Registration is open for the Boswords 2024 Winter Wondersolve, an online crossword tournament which will be held on Sunday, February 4 from 1:00 to 4:30 p.m. Eastern. Solvers can compete individually or in pairs and will complete four puzzles (three themed and one themeless) edited by Brad Wilber. To register, to see the constructors, and for more details, go to www.boswords.org.
[Follow Rex Parker on Twitter and Facebook]

147 comments:

Anonymous 5:40 AM  

I hated this lmao. I’ve got plenty to say but I’m tired from that rough fill (and also it being the middle of the night) so I will hold my tongue for today! Except for this: TCBY??? I’ve never once heard of it, plus its placement and the crosses were AWFUL. Biggest yikes there for me in a grid full of yikes.

Anonymous 5:57 AM  

Online there were no circles and so I was stuffed.

Smith 6:10 AM  

Challenging, yes, but at least today I got the trick, and I thought it was cool. SlowfadE before SOFTEDGE (former film student) agree with @Rex, what kind of SOFTEDGE are you talking about?
dayDream before acidTRIP before HEADTRIP.
When I figured out the trick I got that satisfying "aha". It took a second because my first thought was THIS AND THAT but it didn't fit, and then I just saw the loops and click!
Initially a nonsense title seemed unfair, especially as a themer, but once it got started I remembered it, even though it was a hit before I was born.
Great fun, thanks Simeon!

Anonymous 6:19 AM  

I didn't see the circles online til the morning - I usually do the puzzle the night before, but I had to put this one down and come back to it. The circles cleared everything up quickly (I actually had the answers but couldn't figure out the gimmick). And I'm certainly glad you also found this challenging, because I was stumped for a bit. I had DAYDREAM in place of HEAD TRIP for a while, which didn't help. Also I thought "Cue predecessor" might be RES.

As for Rama Lama Ding Dong, I don't know if I can share a link here but it's worth trying just so there can be a LITTLE more fun around this puzzle. My son used to watch this over and over when he was small. https://youtu.be/mrB8h-sbfdw?si=Sfrw2yDgOyzG_rJu

Smith 6:24 AM  

@anon 5:57
The circles were there in the web version (ie, not the app)

Adam 6:24 AM  

I thought it was a cool trick and I got RAMA LAMA DING DONG early on because I had the back part filled, I know the song, and the circles spanning four squares all of a sudden made sense. It made the others easier.

mADD before sADD really threw me--I didn't look at the crosses and had to go through the whole puzzle to pull out LOm and fix it to LOS. I think TCBY is gone--The Country's Bankrupt Yogurt, but that was a long time ago and someone could have bought the brand and brought it back somewhere. Oh, SPIDEr before SPIDEY, but that was easily fixed.

I had JAMON early on--good JAMON is a treat!--and so got TAJ without too much effort.

I enjoyed it a lot more than @Rex.

Smith 6:28 AM  

@anon 5:40
TCBY was (maybe is? idk) a pretty well known yogurt chain. I kinda thought the clue should have indicated an acronym, but then I thought maybe they changed the name from The County's Best Yogurt so it's no longer an acronym...

JD 6:30 AM  

Great puzzle, in my pinwheel house. Clever cluing, fun words, no junk. Saw that 16A had to be This That And The Other, and just threw down That And Ther and moved on. Other themers gradually came into view.

Just north of the South here, we had a TCBY but it folded. That's where hubris gets you. Toughest was Negawatt, and I found this on it, "... derived from megawatt and was created by Amory Lovins... (who) saw a typo — "negawatt" instead of "megawatt." Now I appreciate the word, not so much during the solve.

Great cluing for PGA Tour, Ali Baba (took a stab with Alabama when I had the
A L B, quickly disabused). Started with Wambat. Was into Radiant Yoga for a while, done in a hot room but not with the fixed asanas of Hot Yoga.

Big fun.

Anonymous 6:31 AM  

Lousy, can confusing puzzle. And printed out in a compressed way. Bah!

Fun_CFO 6:35 AM  

Yep, the middle was a mess. And yes, sETTLE to METTLE was last correction I made for the music.

First puzzle in a bit that I’ve been below avg time, so I guess a little tougher, but I think mainly I really couldn’t just stay focused. Hit things like ECO (ecocide? ugh. I’d like to enjoy today), the awful ASAMI and AWGEEs of the world and my mind is all “Hmm, any good movies on? News start yet?”

Got the trick with the first themer, and it just wasn’t enough to send me racing to the finish. So a lot of stops and starts and just punched my way through.

ASANA clue is bad editing. So is taking out the constructors’ original clue for the 2nd themer (“Doo-wop refrain incorporating a Hindu deity, a Buddhist monk and a doorbell”) as mentioned in his notes.

Anyway, yep can get some long answers if you make some loops in the grid.

Anonymous 6:37 AM  

Could TAJ/JAMON have been TAR/RAMON?? Just two foreign words crossing, instead.

David Grenier 6:46 AM  

I had the same issue. Started it last night before bed, probably in “dark mode”. No loops. Picked it up this morning and suddenly there are loops (in light mode). Finally the revealer clicked!

Jack Stefano 6:48 AM  

Jamon lol. Ok NYT.

Tony B 7:00 AM  

Hey Rex - it’s called a dive loop. Not a coaster aficionado here but these things do exist.

That said - this puzzle raised my blood pressure. Terrible clueing, a Natick (Bal Harbor) and just a tad too many proper nouns.

Hoping for a Fun Friday.

Anonymous 7:02 AM  

I think "Sects'" is supposed to be short for 'intersections, and a cross is a symbol of intersecting lines.

Anonymous 7:03 AM  

I thought this was a great puzzle with one of the best “aha” moments ever. Everything was nonsense until it made perfect sense.

David Grenier 7:03 AM  

I liked the theme. These architectural gimmick puzzles tickle me. However, I started solving last night in “dark mode” on my phone and there were no loops on the grid. I got the revealer and I initially got THIS AND THAT. When crosses made me realize the beginning of that phrase was incorrect I changed it to THAT AND THIS. I figured it’s a bit of a stretch but somehow switching words in a common phrase was the gimmick. Which really screwed me on finishing the puzzle. I had most of the outer sections but the middle was impossible.

At some point I gave up and went to bed (I’m trying to limit my screen time at night and go back to reading actual novels on paper in bed, it’s been great!). When I came downstairs this morning and restarted my solve it was on “light mode” (normal). Viola, there were loops on the grid. Now it all clicked into place! I quickly replaced THAT AND THIS with TH(IS TH)AT AND TH(E OTH)ER and that section fell into place. From there it was easy to see RAMA LAMA DONG DONG. The middle was still a bit of a mess and I had a DNF on that TAJ/JAMON cross (I had G there because I vaguely thought I’d hear the word GAMON once). But overall a fun solve once I had the loops to help.

Chris Menzel 7:10 AM  

The fact that the LOOPDELOOPS left us with three strings of nonsense on the horizontal…ugh. I could have forgiven all the dubious fill if they could have pulled off the loops *and* left us with actual words.

Anonymous 7:15 AM  

Had to run the alphabet at TAJ/JAMON.

Johnny Laguna 7:16 AM  

@Smith — I had no circles in my app (iPad) but it crashed and when I restarted it forced me to update, and then the circles appeared.

Anonymous 7:16 AM  

The circles were in my iOS app, but I also updated the app this morning before doing the puzzle.

Bill Hood 7:18 AM  

Isn’t it THREE CPO? I’ve never seen THREEPIO.

Andy Freude 7:21 AM  

Agree with Rex 100%. Started with NILS and NIHILO and knew this was not going to be for me.
Actually, not quite 100%. I knew the Edsels from a slightly later novelty song:

“Who put the bomp in the bomp sh-bomp?
. . .
Who put the ram in the rama lama ding dong?”

The Edsels, that’s who.

Anonymous 7:24 AM  

They were missing last night. After updating the app this morning I understood the theme and the last 30% of the puzzle dropped in 5 minutes.

Anonymous 7:26 AM  

The app updated overnight. The circles weren’t there in light mode either yesterday.

Adam12 7:27 AM  

@rex, it was Rudolf Hess not Adolph. Don’t blame you for wanting to forget but best to remember, As much as I agree with you on this one, at least they kept it Nazi free.

Chris 7:29 AM  

Solved this morning on my iPad without updating the app, so I never got the circles. So even after I had filled in LOOPDELOOPS, I had to stare at this for a good ten minutes before the themed answers finally "clicked". But in a way, the lack of the circles made that "a-ha!" moment much more satisfying. Some of the fill was a little awkward, but given the theme, that's not really a surprise. I enjoyed this puzzle (especially after figuring out the gimmick) and was pleased to see something creatively different. Not a bad way to get the brain working on a Thursday morning!

SouthsideJohnny 7:33 AM  

So, 20 is one of the infinite number of numbers that indicates that one is “too old” for Little League - talk about lazy editing. And the clue isn’t even really accurate - a 20 year-old could coach, umpire, pack the brothers and sisters in the car and take them to the ballpark, and/or sit in the stands and enjoy the game.

Opened up the grid and saw all of the hoop earrings and knew this was not going to be one designed with me in mind. Stuck with it a bit until I encountered the EDSELS from 66 years ago, a Persian TAJ crossing what I’m guessing is a Spanish version of Chorizo (unless CHORIZO is Spanish - in which case I’m hoping that tomorrow one of the clues will be “Portuguese version of Chorizo” - after all one is really never too old to expand their horizons (or coach Little League)).

Scratched my head a bit over this OBOE has a “bell” situation, but a little post-solve recon indicated that the “bell” is not the common usage “ring dem bells” that I was contemplating, but is apparently a musical term with a different meaning (something like a flanged end) - close enough for Thursday.

Another in a long line of recent mediocre efforts - still holding out hope for a Robyn Friday tomorrow.



kitshef 7:33 AM  

Rex may not have TCBY where he lives, but I'll bet he has RED BATs. Basically, if you live in the contiguous 48 and not in the Rockies, you have have RED BATs. We all have gaps in our knowledge base, and for Rex one such gap is 'nature', but that's not the puzzle's fault.

Hal9000 7:34 AM  

Native Spanish speaker here, so JAMON and the Latin NIHILO were gimmes. Never heard of TCBY, though, and it crossed a place name so that required some guessing.

Overall, I liked (and got!) the architectural trick quickly enough to breeze through this one and appreciate it, despite the awkward fill.

Bob Mills 7:36 AM  

I got the trick, but couldn't finish because of the East side, where I had "settle" instead of METTLE. That made it impossible. I also never heard of JAMON.

Looking forward to a more normal puzzle on Friday.

Max W. 7:36 AM  

Not sure whether to congratulate or condemn the NYT iOS app for the note my puzzle has this morning: “Some versions of this app are not displaying a a set of circles overlaid on the puzzle. If you are not seeing the circles, please update your app. The puzzle can also be solved on the web or in print.”

On the one hand, at least they’re admitting the puzzle isn’t showing properly for some people. On the other hand, requiring an update (which I happened to do yesterday) to solve…not great. Especially when many people have mega-streaks in the app.

Areawoman 7:39 AM  

Loved this, tough and chewy with a true aha moment, this is why I live for Thursdays

JJK 7:47 AM  

I thought this was just awful and no fun. I didn’t have the circles in my app but that’s not the problem. I got the revealer (more or less - had LOOPtheLOOP for a long time) but could not for the life of me figure out where the looping words were. If this had been done well, one shouldn’t need the actual circles to figure out where the words of the themers loop around. But the cluing on so much of the fill was terrible, and I was just in the dark. Like Rex and others, I had sETTLE absolutely locked in. And I’ve seen TCBY places, but I was looking for an actual type of dessert, not a chain store that sells questionable “desserts”. So that was a huge problem. And I’ve heard of RAMALAMADINGDONG - I just couldn’t figure out how to make it work. CRASH was hard to come by, PEE was bad, and yes, ASANA is just plain wrong for the clue. Ugh.

Anonymous 7:51 AM  

The circles were in the NYT app on my Android phone last night (not that they helped initially).

mmorgan 7:56 AM  

No circles in Across Lite.

Lewis 7:58 AM  

Simeon is ever creative, looking for unusual angles, which is probably why he’s Mr. Thursday, with 9 of his 11 NYT puzzles falling on that day. I love out-of-the-boxness, and so I enter his puzzles with an undercurrent of excitement.

After I uncovered the first theme answer and how to decipher it, my jaw dropped and my whole being resonated with “How did he DO that?” The wows echoed as the theme continued. Oh, I’m guessing computer coding spit out these answers, but I want no confirmation of that. I want to believe that Simeon just has one of those brains that comes up with these things.

He certainly does have one of those brains just to come up with this theme in the first place!

And will you look at how gorgeous the three theme answers are? –
THIS THAT AND THE OTHER
RAMA LAMA DING DONG
WHEN THE TIME COMES

Add Thursday-level bite, that triple-O in TOOOLD, and two rare-in-crossword five-letter semordnilaps (SADAT and STRAD), and I’m floating in Crosslandia bliss.

Kudos, Simeon, for producing a grid that must have been a bear to construct, and thank you for a simply splendid outing!

Anonymous 7:59 AM  

No, it's C3PO. Shortened to 3PO or THREEPIO. Especially by Luke when he's frantic (e.g. in the trash compactor)

Anonymous 8:05 AM  

Really enjoyed this one, I thought the theme was clever and fun. I guess I don't have the hangups that Rex does, some of the fill was a bit awkward but I found it relatively easy for a Thursday.

Anonymous 8:06 AM  

iOS made me update the app in the morning and the circles magically appeared. Someone was scrambling at Puzzles HQ to get their release approved… 😂

Kyle 8:11 AM  

You and I had all the exact same issues with the middle clues and what we thought they should actually be. Settle to mettle still bothers me. I even worked at a TCBY in high school and it didn’t make this any sweeter…

Mack 8:14 AM  

Even without the circles on Android, I didn't mind the gimmick, although I needed the reveal to catch it. After that it's wasn't too hard to parse the themers.

Mostly agree with Rex otherwise: lots of bad clues. It wasn't even necessarily trying to be too clever; it was just bad.
I'm a little surprised by all the JAMÓN confusion, it appears pretty regularly on menus. DOXES is almost always written as DOXxES, but it probably shows up commonly enough with one X for me to accept it as a possible answer.
Along with the NILS/NIHILO problem, I was also quickly turned off by the nearby SUE/ENSUE cross.

BritSolvesNYT 8:15 AM  

My solving experience mirrored Rex almost exactly today. Naticked by the B of BAL and TCBY at the end. There are lots of international solvers so surprised they don't take that into account when considering crosses like this one.

Chrisquid 8:17 AM  

Soft edge is a term in art (painting) education

Liveprof 8:20 AM  

According to the National Association of Nitpickers, TCBY is not an acronym, it's an initialism. And they still exist although much less widely than in their heyday.

Another option for a non-monster Hess is Leon, may he rest in peace, oil magnate and former owner of the hapless NY Jets.

Phil C. 8:24 AM  

Well, I loved it and fell on the easy side of medium. On my Android last night, I had no issues with the circles, and grokked the theme early. If you ever saw Animal House (I have at least 20x), and it was required watching for my generation, you know RAMA LAMA DING DONG, even if the Edsels is a mystery. The masochist in me thinks this could have been solved without the circles.

Sam 8:38 AM  

Very cool theme! The three theme answers each perform two loopdeloops, as promised. Fun stuff.

Anonymous 8:42 AM  

Convoluted. And not in a good way. I’m going out to dog the walk.

SteveF 8:45 AM  

I enjoyed the theme. I work in energy … Negawatt is a concept commonly attributed to Amory Lovins referring to energy not used, usually by energy conservation or efficiency. Meters spin backwards when you generate electricity behind the meter (e.g, solar on your house) and your locally generated electricity goes onto the grid (also called net metering). Maybe I’ve missed it, but I’ve never heard net metering associated with a negawatt.

Anonymous 8:47 AM  

I guess I am the only one with “Arm Sling” before “Swelling.” That messed me up good taking this from a medium to a challenging.

Anonymous 8:48 AM  

Can someone please explain why mettle means resolve? That is not a meaning that appears in any source I’ve checked

Son Volt 8:51 AM  

Liked it - at least it forced some thought and effort. Agree with the questionable fill in spots but nothing critical. The themers - including RAMA LAMA were very straightforward and we get an apt revealer.

CRASH

Knew JAMON but had to back into the rough STN x NEGAWATT cross. PULPED is ugly. Maybe excessive trivia?

Overall a pleasant Thursday morning solve

La Pistola

Anonymous 9:02 AM  

I would guess this is the first time that squares with one quarter of a circle in them have appeared in the NYTXW app, so there wasn't the capability to show them in the existing version of the app, so they pushed an update and told people about it.

Jim in Canada 9:02 AM  

Tony B, a dive loop does exist, but it's not a loop entered from the top, it's a loop entered like a regular camelback hill, but twists over upside-down at the top and 'dives' back to the ground.
Essentially, it's a reverse Immelman.

There ARE, however, at least 9 coasters currently operating that have loops entered at the top. The ones most familiar to the readers here would be Electric Eel at SeaWorld San Diego, Phobia Phear Coaster at Lake Compounce, and Tempesto at Busch Gardens in Virginia.

Anonymous 9:04 AM  

Is anyone able to explain "depression precursor" for CRASH? I am stumped on this one.

burtonkd 9:07 AM  

Very clever theme to think of, however he arrived at the answers. It was nice to have some teeth to a Thursday puzzle in addition to the unusual theme.

I love answers like TAJ: I think to myself that there is no way I'll know it, and then think geographic proximity - everyone has heard of the TAJ Mahal, and can imagine its dome crowns. Jambon is a common enough word in French, and Jamon on tapas menus that it is at least inferrable, if not known. I never saw Q spelled as cue, but reading the clue to myself led to a happy aha.

NEGAWATT. Another unknown to me, but another aha inference. With more and more people owning solar panels, this is increasingly relevant. I'm always disappointed to have to tell the solar panel guy at Costco that I live in a city apartment, so won't be able to purchase any.

Sideeye to the NIL NIHILO crossing, but moved right along.

I don't the complaint about the loop-de-loop. Look at a coaster from the side and it makes a circle.

burtonkd 9:07 AM  

Very clever theme to think of, however he arrived at the answers. It was nice to have some teeth to a Thursday puzzle in addition to the unusual theme.

I love answers like TAJ: I think to myself that there is no way I'll know it, and then think geographic proximity - everyone has heard of the TAJ Mahal, and can imagine its dome crowns. Jambon is a common enough word in French, and Jamon on tapas menus that it is at least inferrable, if not known. I never saw Q spelled as cue, but reading the clue to myself led to a happy aha.

NEGAWATT. Another unknown to me, but another aha inference. With more and more people owning solar panels, this is increasingly relevant. I'm always disappointed to have to tell the solar panel guy at Costco that I live in a city apartment, so won't be able to purchase any.

Sideeye to the NIL NIHILO crossing, but moved right along.

I don't the complaint about the loop-de-loop. Look at a coaster from the side and it makes a circle.

Trina 9:11 AM  

Another “no circles” last night experience. I was flummoxed despite the puzzle being almost complete. Picked it up this morning and voila.

Might have been able to suss it out without the circles except for the “nonsense” clue.

Did someone at the NYT puzzle desk wake up with an ‘oops’ in the middle of the night?

RooMonster 9:12 AM  

Well, my Streak has come to a n end. 46 puzs in a row. I imagine if I stuck it out a bit longer, I would've got it. Alas.

Had STRAt, successfully changing it to STRAD, but wanted NIHILi. I did try all the vowels with D_XES, but I also had TAm/mAMON, so kept getting the Almost There. That was where, if I thought about it a touch longer, I maybe could've gotten that J. But, no. Ah me.

I did like the Theme. Neat to LOOP through the answers. Originally just had THIS AND THAT in the first Themer, because it fit. Once I got SINAI, I saw the THIS in the LOOP, said, "Heyyy, the LOOPS are a word part." Already had ONTO and ASHE, so was able to figure out it was a LOOPy THISTHATANDTHEOTHER. Pretty cool.

Only 34 Blockers. Nice open corners. Neat triple O's in SE. Good puz, except it ended my monumental Streak. But hey, time to start another one!

JAM ON! 😁

Three F's
RooMonster
DarrinV

Anonymous 9:13 AM  

I have a run-backward meter. Have had solar for 20 years. Not one time had I ever heard the term “megawatt.” It’s a made-up word. Terrible, terrible clue.

BlueStater 9:22 AM  

"Yeesh" is right. Worst puzzle in a while, but again, the competition for that title is increasingly fierce....

Nancy 9:23 AM  

Definitely not my kind of puzzle, because...

1) I'm lousy at spatial relations. It was the section I always dreaded most on the SATs. Could never tell, for example, which figure with the missing two cubes had been rotated 180 degrees. I would try rotating my head 180 degrees, but it didn't help.

2) I've totally avoided roller coasters and other scary LOOP DE LOOP sorts of rides my whole life. You couldn't get me on one with a gun to my head.

So this puzzle made me 1) confused and 2) dizzy.

And that was even before I got to the (unfair!!! unfair!!!) Edsels hit with the "nonsense" title (your description, not mine, Simeon.)

I "solved" everything but the Edsels/"cultured dessert" section -- meaning I filled all the letters in. Did I parse everything? No. I felt I was going around in circles and getting vertigo, so I stopped trying.

I imagine Simeon probably had a good time fiddling around with this. Alas, I didn't.

Ruth Wonderly 9:27 AM  

This was brilliant if a little clunky at times. Rex asked “why are "sects" Christian, necessarily? “ They aren’t and the clue didn’t imply that they are. The answer could’ve just as easily been the symbol of a Jewish, Muslim, or Hindu sect but it wasn’t. I remember reading in this blog something called Joachim’s Dictum. Can’t remember it exactly but I think that would apply here.

beverly c 9:54 AM  

Very clever and I'm glad I didn’t have the circles, it made it more puzzling. I saw the three O line up in TOOOLD and wondered if I'd see stacks of Os when I sorted out the starred clues, but it was better than that. Impressive.

RooMonster 10:04 AM  

Just got Queen 🐝!!
*Pats self on back*
🐝🐝 😁

RooMonster Bee-utiful Guy

Anonymous 10:04 AM  

Got the theme somewhat sluggishly this am (bad night) and the timer ticked past 10 for the first time in a while on a weekday. I did enjoy the puzzle, jumped around and got bites here and there before finishing at METTLE. I had written in SETTLE on the first go round, but SYMAN didn't make sense

Although Little League is usually thought of as 12 and under League, I believe they have leagues for boys and girls up to 18, so 20 is a fair clue

Thanks to constructor for nice Thursday challenge!

Anonymous 10:05 AM  

Absolutely despised this puzzle. I agree with everything Rex said. The loops were not intuitive or consistently placed at all. To answer his question, however, some roller coasters do have “downward” loops as well as the more conventional ones, such as Tatsu at Magic Mountain in California. To digress from crosswords. Tatsu is a wild ride, you’re suspended underneath the track facing forward as if you’re flying like Superman. When you go through the downward loop, the Gs feel like a large appliance is sitting on your back.

walrus 10:05 AM  

the best way i’ve found to approach many puzzles—especially the last year of mostly sub-par thursdays—is to avoid the theme clues for as long as possible. today this resulted in not dealing with the themers at all.
if you enjoy cured meats, jamón iberico is a wonderful treat; i can’t say the same about tcby as a dessert option.

Niallhost 10:08 AM  

I was certain it was shAMALAMADINGDONG for too long. Couldn't make it work until I did the loop de loop and it was the only option. I had settled on sETTLE and nothing was going to change MY MAN's mind on that, so DNF for me.

egsforbreakfast 10:10 AM  

This puzzle left me asking WHETIMES does THATANDTHER RAMADING happen? I solved it on my iPad, which was NOTPC, believe me.

Talk about the original NEGAWATT. That has to be Jim Watt, former Secretary of the Interior under Reagan. Not to beat a dead horse, but here was a typical tribute after Watt's death: "While no one's death should be celebrated, he was the worst of MAGA before it was invented," tweeted David Donger of the environmental group Natural Resources Defense Council, referring to former President Donald Trump's "Make America Great Again" slogan.

I think I'll have to sETTLE for sYMAN as my future brotherly greeting. It kinda seems in keeping with the times (both ours and the NYT).

Last time I was asked if I wanted another serving of JAMON, I had to say "No MAS, ALAS. I'm full."

Shoutout to @LEWIS at 56A. He richly deserves it for finding the gold where others find dross.

And thanks to Simeon Seigel for this loopy delight of a puzzle.

Anonymous 10:17 AM  

T AJ/JAMON kicked me in the butt. And I friggin Googled The Edsel song. I hate hate to do that. but I did and I am somewhat ashamed.... but such is life. And the Little League clue??? 20? why? I think 13 or 14 would have fit much better without bordering on weirdness. I liked this puzzle a lot - reminded me of Lightening Loops at Six Flags Great Adventure back in the 80s.

Anonymous 10:18 AM  

Same! I started it last night, set it aside (due to the same sETTLE error Rex mentioned), and when I opened the app this morning it forced me to update before I could continue. And then the circles appeared. Wild

pabloinnh 10:22 AM  

A little late because of my annual physical (I'm fine, thank you), saw the large number of comments already and thought, "app problems", and sure enough. For my part, it was another print out with no left margin and circles so faint I didn't notice them until LOOPTHELOOP made me look harder. Also had to fix LOOPDELOOPS, obviously. That gave me the gimmick and things started to make sense. That and being old enough to remember RAMALAMADINGDONG.

JAMON was a gimme but I'm not sure I would describe plain old ham as a "cured meat". Nice to find out what TAJ means though, as I have never thought about it and it makes perfect sense.

Only other hold ups were CCS for HAS and especially STA for STN for too long. Made that NEGAWATT thing hard to see.

I liked your Thursday a lot, SS. You're a Sly Satan (tricky devil), and thanks for all the fun.

Ciclista21 10:26 AM  

Rex, Rex, Rex, how have you achieved your current modicum of years and never encountered jamòn? Hie thee to the nearest tapas bar! Or the nearest upscale deli.

As for “Rama Lama Ding Dong”, is the song that obscure? I assumed the puzzle’s concept started there, no need for an algorithm.

But agreed, much here is bland, or just plain lazy on our friend Will’s part. NILS/NIHILO indeed!

andrew 10:30 AM  

For $50 and a free day at Magic Mountain, I was an extra in the movie Rollercoaster. Had my choice of being in a crowd scene or ride the newfangled, upside down coaster. Stupidly chose the latter, not knowing that George Segal would muff line after line (as I was later told by those wisely on the ground).

Must have been stuck on that monstrosity for 40 minutes that seemed an eternity. Nauseous, but kept my cookies - as people around me were throwing up. Every time it came down to the exit, despite the prayers that this please STOP, it just kept going. Looping and looping. Vomiting and vomiting. FUN!

Never been able to ride much more than an airport tram ever since. Thanks, Segal!

Wait, think we’re here to talk about the puzzle. Didn’t like it much. Rebuses I can handle. Anything looping - on paper or via app - triggers my PTSD!

Loop de Loop THIS!

EasyEd 10:37 AM  

I’m one of the crowd that overnight found my lead had turned to gold. And so doubly appreciate @eggs shoutout to @Lewis. I thought a great construction feat with minimal clunky clues. Got TCBY from frequent turnpike driving in years gone by, but sadly missed SADD.

Anonymous 10:41 AM  

PEE really bothered me for some reason, clued the way it was

Visho 10:41 AM  

Car crash leaves a depression in your vehicle.

jberg 10:42 AM  

While the circles did appear in the printed paper (along with the name of Adolph OCHS, on the masthead--which I did NOT look at while solving!), but they were very faint, so I forgot about them. The first two themers seemed a bit truncated--I had THAT AND more, changed it to some (as in 'that and then some'); and RAMADING was OK, I figured -- but then I read the clue for 9-D, which fit TERSE but not TEnSE, and it all made sense. It actually helped me drop the idea of 'in due TIME for WHEN THE TIME COMES. Soo all in all, I enjoyed it.

Apparently the tapas craze has not spread as far as I'd thought, JAMON is an absolutely standard item, right up there with papatas bravas and gambas ajillo. The JAMON serrano, cited by Rex, is fine, but pay the extra money for the JAMON Iberico, you won't regret it.

I knew the TAJ Mahal, of course, but didn't know the word was Persian. But Persian is in the same language group as Sanskrit, so I went with it.

if your meter runs backward you are saving money, but you are not saving energy -- just the opposite, you are producing more energy than you use, and selling the surplus to the grid.

Explanations:

1) I asked Duck-Duck-Go to define METTLE, and this was the first hit:

noun
The ability to meet a challenge or persevere under demanding circumstances; determination or resolve.
"a race that tested the best runners' mettle."

2) The CRASH of 1929 led to the Great Depression.

Conrad 10:44 AM  


I came this close to stopping my solve and walking away (I never do that).

I used to live near a TCBY, but now the closest one is more than an hour away.

Misremembered the droid's name as "three cpo". Wrong. Corrected that to "c-three po". Right, but still no joy. Finally erased it completely and relied on crosses to get me to THREEPIO.

Visho 10:45 AM  

Struggled mightily, but the light finally dawned! Loved the work out and the puzzle. One hangup...ISHMAEL before of ALIBABA. Oops.

Gary Jugert 10:47 AM  

Those LOOP-DE-LOOPS were soooo fun. WHEN THE TIME COMES was my first victory after finding the reveal and then I couldn't hardly wait to do the others.

Like 🦖, the middle of the puzzle was toughest for me despite getting MASALA with no crosses. I kept doubting it, but OCHS was the real trouble maker since ENOS and OTIS both tried to substitute. Didn't know TAJ, couldn't see JAMON, what the heck is going on with the clue for SEC?, never heard of BAL Harbour, and SETTLE instead of METTLE messed with MY MAN. But other than that, no problem. 🤪

So when 1A is NILS, as a constructor, wouldn't you think, "I've gotta fix that."? Why alienate us on clue one when NILA, NILE, NILI, NILK, NILL, NILO, NILU, NILX and NILY are all ready to be put into the game on a Thursday.

I guess Simeon decided to leave NON-PC in his word list. Way to uphold the proud tradition of thought shaming. And NEGAWATT. Someone has all the letters in his software.

I love SPIDEY [sense], HEAD TRIP, HOT YOGA, and ACT ALONE.

Uniclues:

1 Eats the favorite fare of plural-of-convenience haters.
2 Morgiana, as it turns out.
3 UNESCO World Heritage site located in Flibbertigibbet, Djibouti.
4 Mom's plan for everything related to her teenager.
5 How I broke my collar bone in college.
6 As a substitute for drinking alcohol, campus group hosted pudding wrestling as an activity.
7 How he got sharp.
8 Sign on a box of robot parts.
9 NASA engineer leaving his house in the 50s.
10 Each United States Congress electee at work.
11 Procedure for rolling your car six times in the median.

1 HAS ROAST NILS (~)
2 ALI BABA METTLE
3 TAJ RAMALAMADINGDONG
4 WHEN THE TIME COMES: NAH
5 IPA LOOP-DE-LOOPS
6 SADD GOT MESSY (~)
7 STRAD SWELLING
8 THREEPIO EX NIHILO (~)
9 ON TO CRASH APES
10 TOO OLD HEAD TRIP (~)
11 CROSS SOFT EDGE (~)

My Fascinating Crossword Uniclue Keepsake from Last Year: Tastes like chili, looks like chili, smells like chili... not chili. SLY STEED STEWS.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Dan 10:50 AM  

It never ceases to amaze me how I can so thoroughly enjoy a puzzle, and then come to this blog and find out that it's actually the worst puzzle ever.

I loved it! And yes, those circles are exactly what loop-de-loops look like from the side. If you think of the bottom line of the themer squares as the track, the circles take off from them and loop back around to them again. Perfect.

RAMALAMADINGDONG is a lyric from the finale of the musical Grease and so it was easy for me to infer. I didn't know it was actually the title of an earlier song, but for me, that's part of the fun of crosswords. Finding out things I didn't know.

Beezer 11:06 AM  

I was very lucky to have looked at the flashing “i” on my iPad app before I started the puzzle, so I updated and voila…circles were there! At some point I knew I had the beginnings or portions of answers that were partially nonsense and for whatever reason I went to revealer and immediately put in LOOPDELOOP. Then away I went and actually USED the concept to complete the puzzle. EXCEPT, nope I didn’t complete the puzzle…I was foiled at the intersection of TAJ and JAMON. BUT. I really enjoyed the puzzle warts and all, ie. TCBY (which I was familiar with but kind of did an eye-roll when it became clear).

@anonymous 8:48…with resolve/mettle, think of it as a noun. Back when I played “competitive” doubles tennis sometimes my partner and I would say to each other…”remember, we need to maintain our steely resolve.” Often this statement would also make us start laughing, but hey…we weren’t playing for prizes!

Also…I guess the guy who built the TAJ Mahal was Persian? If I knew that, I forgot.

KBF 11:16 AM  

Stock market crash of 1929 led to the Great Depression of the '30s.

Anonymous 11:19 AM  

All words are made-up words

Newboy 11:21 AM  

Needed the iPhone upgrade today for “Connections” but strangely the iPad never alerted me to the necessity for Xwordage, so another hand up for the Circle the Wagons club. CROSSing answers were pretty obvious for the most part that suggested that the odd star clue answer also had to be correct….why? That was a NIT to be scratched for a moment or three, but with LOOPDELOOPS revealed things began to right themselves.

efrex 11:23 AM  

Well, I guess I've got a little bit of everyone in me today: took some time to suss out the theme, but once I did, I was more than willing to forgive a lot of the fill. Reading the "loops" was enjoyable enough to tolerate the gunk and even with the overwrites of THISANDTHAT and THATANDTHIS, managed to finish just under my standard Thursday time. Wanted CURRIES before MASALAS, so things were a bit MESSY, but nothing a few minutes' rethinking couldn't figure out.

TAJ/JAMON was my last letter - this kosher eater isn't much for Iberian ham; sorry!

Probably have a few more NITs to pick, but I'm not gonna LEANIN to the negativity. Fun theme, fun solve; I'm pleased with that. Nicely done, Mr. Seigel!

Carola 11:30 AM  

"And now for something completely different" - at least I can't remember another Thursday trick like this one - and a lot of fun to figure out. When I'd finished, I followed the rollercoaster track through the LOOPs with a highlighter, admiring how they alternated between going clockwise and counterclockwise. Elsewhere, my favorite clue was "Resolve" - so so easy to settle for sETTLE - I loved the light-bulb moment when METTLE clicked in.

@Simeon Seigel, thank you for the exhilarating ride through those three terrific theme phrases and LOOPy reveal.

TJS 11:32 AM  

I cant believe I'm paying for this.

Anonymous 11:35 AM  

Stock market crash in 1929 preceded the depression.

Kate Esq 11:39 AM  

I actually thought this was great. A theme with proper Thursday trickiness. I had the circles on my app, which helped, and I filled the revealed early, but it took me some time to figure out how the trick worked and figuring it out felt VERY satisfying. (And it was Rama Lama Ding Dong that helped me figure it out - I had heard the phrase, got some from crossings, tried to fit it in the squares, and the obvious repeats in the phrase made the trick clearer after quite a bit of muddling around. WHEN THE TIME COMES fell swiftly after that, and eventually THIS THAT AND THE OTHER. I liked that each theme answer had two loops - it made it more challenging. There was some weak cluing/fill for sure (red bat and aw gee) but I did like ALI BABA and THREEPIO and while I’ve never heard of a NEGAWATT but I was fond of the coinage. And the theme was satisfying enough I didn’t mind the weak parts of the fill.

I don’t find JAMON particularly obscure - though I was trying to figure out how to cram Chorizo in there, Jamon Iberico, Jamon Serrano, and if you’re lucky, Jamon de Bellota are reasonably available in foodie spots and circles (though living in SoCal with ubiquitous Spanish may also help).

jae 11:40 AM  

Tough. Sussing out the theme took some time (no circles in the app on my iPad last night) but my biggest problem was, like @Rex et. al., sETTLE before METTLE. Also TCBY wasn’t obvious given the clue and the Edsel’s song is a tad obscure. So that section was very tough for me too.

Clever, liked it more than @Rex did but he is right about the fill.

GILL I. 11:41 AM  

Ay Dios mío. First day I'm back full of rust and enthusiasm and I meet up with NIHILO and DOXES. They ran my bar to the ground. Rebuild. I did. I'm going to figure out what the circles mean even if I SETTLE, oops METTLE through. I did.
When THIS THAT AND THE OTHER was pulled mightily from the LOOP DE LOOPS, I smiled. Well shucky darns, a roller coaster ride that didn't make me want to toss any cookies. I didn't.
I had trouble everywhere filling in the the tea cup rides surrounding the main attraction. NEGAWATT didn't like THREE PEO without his C. Guessed the right AS AM I and wondered if TAJ could be right. I know my Spanish JAMON but it could've been tapas for several guesses. TCBY? Yikes. I knew BAL Harbour... I've shopped there. I scratched my head wondering what subject is covered in a madrasa. What's a madrasa? Didn't know actress Juliette LEWIS. 20 is TOO OLD for little league. What a strange way to clue that....
I knew SOFT EDGE because in art you actually have three types of edges: Hard, soft, and lost. SOFT is a gradual transition. (sigh).
I thought this entertaining. I've not seen this kind of Thursday before with circles of delight. I laughed at LOOP DE LOOPS. It made me think back to the days at carnivals riding rickety rides while eating something sweet and sticky. This one filed the bill.

TJS 11:47 AM  

To Anon. 8:48. Think "to test ones' mettle".

jb129 11:49 AM  

I started out thinking "Oh, I can do this" when I liked 23A ALI BABA only to realize that I couldn't. DNF for me (had to cheat).

Very impressive, Simeon!

Alan B 11:51 AM  

Mettle and resolve are semantically realated, they can be used almost interchangeably in the expression "test your mettle/resolve" though the meaning of each is slightly different. I agree those are not really the same, but the association is strong enough that I automatically put in mettle... Meanwhile "settle" is actually synonymous with "resolve" so I see the frustration :)

Anonymous 11:53 AM  

I was thinking market crash before economic depression.

Quinn’s 11:53 AM  

“Soft Edge” is a watercolor painting term. It means the absence of a defined line when there is a color change, and instead, the color fades.

Anonymous 11:54 AM  

There’s BAL Harbour and also Bay Harbor right next to each other. Another (almost) Kealoa if you don’t pay attention to the spelling of Harbour.

@Jim in Canada- you forgot the diving type of loop on the flying coasters like Tatsu, entered from the top but again flipped around so you’re on top of the track at the bottom.
There are no true outside loops on coasters- yet. The Gs would kill you!

Anonymous 11:55 AM  

liz phair in your musical tie-ins ftw. !!

MkB 12:24 PM  

Got the SI in the first circle and was really convinced (and excited) that it was a going to be some sort of trigonometry theme.

Oh well.

Nancy 12:24 PM  

OMG -- METTLE, not sETTLE! That solves the mystery of sE??N at 25D. I would have gotten MY MAN and, ERGO, would have gotten the Y of TCBY. Thank you, @Carola! While nothing would have helped me with the nonsense title, a lot of my sticking points would have been cleared up.

@andrew (10:30)-- One of the great Rexblog anecdotes ever, very well told. You have my deepest sympathy for having to have gone through it, although it makes me pat myself on the back for having made damn sure to avoid any such experiences my entire life.

BTW, @andrew, I sent you a shoutout quite late on yesterday's blog.

johnk 12:42 PM  

DNF. Horrible slog.
Not a bad theme, given a Thursday. But the fill? NAH!
Complete unknowns: DOXES, TCBY, LEWIS, YOLO, SADD, THREEPIO, NEGAWATT (boo!), HOT YOGA.
Hmmms: NIHILO(A?), SUE (for peace? Huh?), NOB, CROSS, ISLAM, STN (STA?)

Masked and Anonymous 12:58 PM  

Like @egs, thought it was a nice, loopy ThursPuz theme. And single-puzthemed, which was a welcome relief.
Would be tough as nails, to come up with a symmetric(al) set of themers, for this rodeo. Maybe @RP's suspicions that an AI search was involved could hold some water, here?

staff weeject pick: TAJ. A no-know, at our house. And crossin another no-know with JAM ON it. sheesh.

debut & no-know combos: DOXES. JAMON. NEGAWATT.

fave stuff: RAMALAMADINGDONG [epic-great doo-wopper from the 50s. M&A has the 45rpmer]. ALIBABA clue. Learnin to SETTLE for METTLE.

Better clue dept. - {Run like 60, for Little League, say?} = TOOOLD. {Bears do it in double-themed puzzles} = CROSS.

Thanx for the run-around, Mr. Seigel dude. Primo ThursPuz and nanosecond-gobbler.

Masked & Anonymo2Us


**gruntz**

okanaganer 1:09 PM  

An interesting theme, but boy did it take a bit of mental exertion to negotiate those loops. Whenever I see that note, I take a screenshot of the grid on the NYT web page and keep it on my left hand monitor while solving in Across Lite. It works, but adds complexity as I wonder "does the circle start here, or here?"

Finished with an error, as I have definitely heard of BAR Harbour, and BAL just seemed so wrong. Also TAL crossing JAMON was tough.

[Spelling Bee: Wed 0; QB streak at 7.]

sharonak 1:25 PM  

thankyou anonymous 6:19 for sharing that. IT was indeed delightfully fun, and the music lovely to listen to unlike most of what Rex puts other which just assaults my ears and other nerve endings

Anoa Bob 1:46 PM  

Father/son conversation:

Father: "Wow! Just turning it off and then back on really did fix the problem."

Son: [rolls eyes] "Duh! I TOOOLD you so!"

One NIT: A 64A NIT is a louse egg. It's not until it hatches that it becomes a "Cause of some head-scratching", as clued. Good reason to be ever vigilant in picking NITs before they become lice!

My favorite TAJ is blues artist TAJ Mahal. Here's a video from his appearance on the OLD Flip Wilson TV show in 1973, "Cakewalk Into Town".

Anonymous 1:52 PM  

I stopped solving this after Act Alone.

MetroGnome 2:08 PM  

I thought YOLO was a county in California, and I still have no idea what TCBY stands for or what it has to do with dessert.

Georgia 2:11 PM  

Super clever! Impressive to me.

Anonymous 2:20 PM  

A stock market CRASH can be the precursor to an economic depression (e.g., 1929 in the U.S.).

Anonymous 2:57 PM  

But following crossword "rules" the answer is wrong because Artoo is one droid's *first* name, so the answer should not be the other droid's *last* name.

Anonymous 3:15 PM  

Mine didn't have circles either. A good way to make sure this kind of problem doesn't happen in the future is to just construct a normal puzzle and not an overwrought gimmick.

Anonymous 3:20 PM  

Asana is actually just a word for a sitting meditation pose than then got usage as a yoga term. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asana

Probably would've been better to clue it as yoga-specfic since it's the more common usage, but it wasn't incorrect.

CDilly52 3:38 PM  

All I can say is that without the circles, the themers were tough, but thank goodness for the rational downs!! I got those and I was 100% sure of RAMA LAMA DING DONG (I loved that song as a kid) and easily saw that it wouldn’t fit. I had the DING going across from completing all the three top sections.

And then for some reason, I fell into the “cultured dessert” pothole at 27 A. I was certain it was some sort of yogurt dessert, but a “brand” never crossed my mind, and I am not that familiar with Florida cities.

MASALAS thankfully was a gimme and since I had the DING already, I tried RAMA and thinking about BAr Harbour Maine, I took a leap of faith and the guessed B gave me the TCBY. And with this I had all of the RAMA LAMA DING DONG letters and figured out that we were adding some letters from other answers to get the theme. But I had no idea other than the * if the theme “additions” were somehow consistently identified on the grid itself because I almost never read the title pages before I do the puzzle.

For that reason, this one played hard in the theme areas, especially THIS THAT AND THE OTHER. It’s a phrase I have not often heard, and WHEN THE TIME COMES is just enough “off” that it didn’t feel quite as tight as the others. But again, the downs did it for me.

As it happens, I rather enjoyed not having the circles; it toughened up the solve, and I enjoyed that. We seem to have had quite a few easy ones lately.

Sure, all the über technical things @Rex points out are what they are. And of course technological assists are part of crossword construction these days. Tech is part of everything now. It’s a tool and everyone uses tools. As for the circles not really being LOOP DE LOOPS, again I say so what.
However Simeon Siegel created this, I consider today a good Thursday offering, better than some we have seen in a while. Enjoyed it a lot.

And PS to the NYT folks who do upkeep on the app to which many subscribe. I read the title page and note after completing the puzzle. Updating my app did nothing to improve the grid. Still no circles. NYT, we pay for this; fix it please.



Lynn 3:46 PM  

Negawatts is a thing. Coined by Amory Lovins at the Rocky Mountain Institute a bunch of years ago (at least 30 years ago?). And our electric meter runs backwards when our solar panels generate more electricity than we are using at any given time. So that's a thing too. Fun to watch!

Anonymous 3:47 PM  

These are their uttered nicknames in the films, regardless of position, so seems fair.

Anonymous 4:03 PM  

I have no idea how I’ve never heard it since I definitely used to go out for yogurt all the time! I guess there were just never any TCBYs around me.

spectre 4:42 PM  

Threepio? Isn't it C3po?

Anonymous 4:56 PM  

Ditto!

Anonymous 5:03 PM  

Granted I have had a miserable day so maybe I'll change my mind tomorrow, but this puzzle made me never want to do another NYT puzzle. So much absurdly trivial crap crossing more absurdly trivial crap. Natick after Natick, proper noun after proper noun, random foreign language after random foreign language. I absolutely hated this. Terrible fill, terrible theme, terrible puzzle, terrible constructor.

Anonymous 5:29 PM  

Whether NEGAWATT is thing, or not, the clue for it is willfully bad.

A watt is a unit of power, not of energy.


Villager

bocamp 5:45 PM  

Thx Simeon; fun challenge! 😊

Downs-o in progress (very slow progress) lol

I think I've got the upper left quad right, but still can't quite grok the theme and how it all works. I see the circles, and came up with THIS THAT AND THE OTHER in that area.

With the downs I have crossing 61A, it looks like there may be something to do with loops or hoops, so that makes sense wrt the circles. Unfortunately, the rest of the puz is not cooperating the way the the NW area did, as I was fairly confident of most of the downs there.

This will be an ongoing project. 🤞
___
David Balton & Jane Stewart's NYT acrostic was relatively easy; fun & funny! 😄

Loving Jeff Chen's new word game: Squeezy.
___
Peace 🕊 🇺🇦 ~ Compassion ~ Tolerance ~ Kindness ~ Freudenfreude & a DAP to all 👊 🙏

Anonymous 5:48 PM  

RIFE clued as Lousy (with) doesn’t click for me. If something is lousy it might be rife with… something, but they aren’t interchangeable, a word is missing from one of those phrases.

First Thursday DNF in a long time. Had no shot with the middle fill cRASh/OChS/TcbY/bAL. Might have come up with CRASH eventually, but having never heard of TCBY, TC wasn’t a letter pair I tried.

Joe 6:02 PM  

What a horrible slog! Just horrible.

Stevelo 8:48 PM  

Ridiculous.

Anonymous 9:40 PM  

Yea it’s pretty much always “Artoo” and “Threepio” in the movies. Also, that’s how they’re written in licensed books.

B$ 9:40 PM  

This was pure genius. And enjoyable.
And sussing out the trick was challenging.

A lot of negativity on these boards . . . . . .

Anonymous 9:51 PM  

Sects’ symbol = Sex symbol, no?

Peter P 10:26 PM  

I guess being a bit of a foodie helped, as JAMON was a total gimme. I mean Jamon Iberico, Jamon Serrano. They're some of the most sought-after cured hams in the world, if not the most sought after.

I put it to bed last night without figuring out what the gimmick was exactly, and I just now finished it, seeing all the circles and with the dominoes falling quickly after into place, for an average Thursday time. It would have been a quick finish had those circles been there yesterday.

For the THREEPIO questions: Yes, it's C3PO, but I believe in print and fan fiction the two droids are referred to as ARTOO (you'll see this in the crossword again, so put it to memory) and THREEPIO. Also, spelling out the name and making it a nickname gives the characters a bit more "humanity," for lack of better word. I am not a Star Wars expert, though. (Haven't seen a movie in the franchise since last century.)

I really enjoyed the puzzle once the circles appeared! I was 80% of the way there, but I'm not sure I would have figured out the trick before giving up, and I don't think I had to crosses to finish it out.

Anonymous 11:00 PM  

The Country’s Best Yogurt. It’s a frozen yogurt place and, yes, they are still around.

Scott in Chicago 11:06 PM  

re: Gradual transition, in art - yeah, this is called gradiant

A. 12:02 AM  

I am so not impressed that the circles weren’t in the app. How can I use the app if it so often doesn’t properly display the puzzle? This might have been fun with the circles.

Counterpoint 12:09 AM  

@Ruth Wonderly, 9:27 AM

This comment set me and my partner off on an online sleuthing journey to find out what "Joachim's Dictum" could be. After enough searching, we found it explained in the comments of the September 28, 2021 puzzle on this blog.

First of all, it's "Joaquin's Dictum," not Joachim. User Joaquin says in the comments there that user @mathgent named it after him, and he explains it as such: "Clues are just hints; they're not definitions and they're not synonyms. So they need not be precise and don't need to apply in all situations. They're just "clues" to assist one in figuring out the answers."

@Joaquin, that's brilliant. I won't forget your Dictum any time soon! And thank you, @Ruth, for mentioning this and leading me to discovery!

Anonymous 7:01 AM  

Let people dislike what they dislike.

Anonymous 7:02 AM  

It’s not brilliant or even accurate

Peter P 7:37 AM  

@A - They did eventually appear in the app. I have no idea whether they were originally (as in late Wednesday) on the web version or not. Some posts seem to suggest they weren't; others seem to suggest they were.

I agree about the criticism of the "sects'" complaint. "Sects' symbol" doesn't imply all sects, just multiple ones. I don't mind the specificity of Christianity with the CROSS answer. That said, it is a bit of forced pun with "sex symbol" (of course) and suffers from trying just a bit too hard.

Deciminyan 5:51 PM  

The reason that the NBC chimes are G-E-C is because NBC, which was originally owned by RCA, became part of the General Electric Company in 1985.

Anonymous 8:24 AM  

As soon as I wrote Gradient instead of softedge…it was all over.

Anonymous 9:45 AM  

I loved the theme. Rex hated it. Life somehow goes on…

spacecraft 11:41 AM  

DNF. Started at the bottom (where there were no %@&!* circles), so I GOT the LOOPDELOOPS, but still didn't know how they applied in the grid, exactly. I stared and stared and stared at that SW circle, and for the life of me couldn't see anything that made any sense. And anyway, there was a whole bunch of no-know clues throughout the top section, I just threw in. From too easy to impossible...is there no middle ground?

Wordle birdie via a curious route: BBBBG BBBBG GGGGG.

Anonymous 1:18 PM  

A veritable pisser infestation.

Anonymous 3:45 PM  

Another absolutely crap puzzle. So much complete dreck fill. Will Shortz has failed us. Big drop-off in puzzle quality in 2024. Of course my input to this 02/01/24 puzz is weeks old, because the cheap f-ing Seattle Times won't publish it on the day it was issued. Today is 03/07/24, 5 weeks after the NYT published entry 0201 in 2024. The only benefit of that is I am able to innediatelread others opinions on the puz. End of RANT!!!

Burma Shave 5:46 PM  

NOT TOOOLD

MY SPIDEY sense says SUE is HOT,
fro THIS,THAT,ANDTHEOTHER, TOO,
but THE ACTALONE is WATT we GOT
WHENTHETIMECOMES for me ENSUE.

--- NILS LEWIS

rondo 6:21 PM  

I got it but spent way too much time on it, especially the middle. One write-over, my 25a Resolve was sETTLE before METTLE.
Wordle birdie.

Diana, LIW 6:54 PM  

The circles sure helped out with this Thursday puzzle - thanks! So, as you can tell, I enjoyed it.

Diana, LIW for Crosswords

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