Soup stock in Japanese cuisine / THU 10-30-25 / Genre for Aretha Franklin or Usher / Chicago exchange, for short / Flour used in Indian flatbreads / What pulls out all the stops? / Food generally known outside the U.S. as "lady's fingers" / Lake in the homeland of the Washoe people / Fish also known as a batomorph

Thursday, October 30, 2025

Constructor: Howard Neuthaler

Relative difficulty: Very easy

[Before you enter the last letter...]

[... and after]

THEME: "DEFYING GRAVITY" (66A: With 68-Across, "Wicked" song suggested by the answers to the seven starred clues (and whose singer is spelled by the circled letters reading from left to right) — seven Down answers must be written in with their last letter appearing first, as if the last letter has unnaturally risen up or ... defied gravity. The levitating (green) letters spell out "ELPHABA," the (green) witch who sings "DEFYING GRAVITY" ... the letters of ELPHABA's name are arranged in triangle formation, a bit like the outline of a witch's cloak in flight (no idea if this is a feature of the puzzle or a mild hallucination on my part):

Theme answers:
  • ETHOS --> THOSE (2D: *The ones over there)
  • LEASE --> EASEL (29D: *Stand before a meeting)
  • PADRE --> AD REP (5D: *One selling commercial time, informally)
  • HEART --> EARTH (45D: *Your home)
  • ALOOF --> LOOFA (9D: *It's used to scrub the tub)
  • BRAND --> R AND B (32D: *Genre for Aretha Franklin or Usher)
  • AKRON --> KRONA (12D: *Some Scandinavian money)
Word of the Day: ELPHABA Thropp (see circled letters) —

Elphaba Thropp [...] is the protagonist of Gregory Maguire's 1995 novel Wicked: The Life and Times of the Wicked Witch of the West, the novel's musical theatre adaptation, and the musical's two-part film adaptationWicked (2024) and Wicked: For Good (2025). She is a reimagining of the Wicked Witch of the West from L. Frank Baum's 1900 novel The Wonderful Wizard of Oz.

In the Baum novel, the Witch is unnamed and little is explained about her life; Wicked creates a backstory for her and explores the world of The Wizard of Oz from her perspective. Elphaba is modeled after Margaret Hamilton's portrayal in the 1939 film The Wizard of Oz: green-skinned, clad entirely in black and wearing a tall peaked hat. Maguire formulated the name "Elphaba" from the pronunciation of Baum's initials—"L.F.B.". (wikipedia)

• • •


I would criticize this theme for being too show-specific (and for being too much like a paid promotion—"See Wicked: For Good, in theaters November 21!," I half-expected an enthusiastic voice to exclaim upon completion), and I can see how this puzzle might've been irksome for people who don't pay very close attention to popular culture generally (I didn't really know anything about Wicked until last year, frankly), but for those of us who are familiar with the musical (and in my case it's really only half-familiar), the puzzle is pretty impressive. Pretty magnificent, actually, at least thematically (the fill ... eh, we'll get to that). There are so many aspects of the theme that really ... elevate it 😎. First of all, there's the green. It is rare that I think that technological advances in puzzle software have yielded anything really worthwhile (animations etc. often leave me cold), but having the thematic material be green today was a really nice touch. Elphaba's green-ness is iconic—it's the most recognizable visual element of the book and musical, in all its promotion. So hurray for that, and hurray for the fact that all the seemingly "wrong" Downs with the levitating circles in them are actually real terms in their own right. ETHOS, PADRE, ALOOF, etc. The letter doesn't just levitate, but creates a whole other word. And the letters spell out ELPHABA's name, and the letters form a triangle that looks kinda like a witch's cape, and (if you're solving on your computer or phone) that "cape" stops "DEFYING GRAVITY" and returns to earth once you've correctly completed the puzzle (if you think of the green grid-spanning answer "DEFYING GRAVITY" as the ground or "earth" in this puzzle). Thematically, the puzzle is doing a lot of things, and doing them all well. If you know the show, it's hard to imagine your not liking this theme.


For me, this puzzle was way, way too easy. Maybe the idea was that some people might not be familiar with the movie, so the puzzlemakers wanted to make sure those people could still solve it successfully. I dunno. But I got the theme concept almost instantly ...


... and while I loved the whole way the theme unfolded, I did not have to struggle at all to make it unfold. Whoosh and whoosh and done. Lots and lots and lots of short stuff made the grid both easy and a little dull / overfamiliar. And then the long stuff ... look, I was prepared to let one EAT A SANDWICH-type answer go—MAKE A CAMEO is pretty solid, as such answers go—but then the puzzle hits me with a second?! (GOT A TAN). NAW, man, NAW, come on. That and NO ONE ON made me wince a little (I'll give NO ONE ON a pass, though, as it is a somewhat inventive debut, and one that appears during the climactic week of the baseball season—the Blue Jays are now up 3 games to 2 on the Dodgers and could win it all ... on Halloween!) (CANADA BEAMED feels like a premonition!). But overall, the fill is by no means bad, and there's some sparkly stuff in there, like PARAGON. Really hated "OK, GOOGLE," as the puzzle already felt like a paid promotion. Boo. Did an AD REP write this puzzle? Ad copy = bad copy. Especially ad copy for surveillance robots. Stop it.


More:
  • 18A: What pulls out all the stops? (DRANO) — does it "pull," though? This answer took several crosses to get.
  • 37D: Chicago exchange, for short (MERC) — wrote in MUNI, which ... I think is the transit system in S.F.? Yes.
  • 19A: Food generally known outside the U.S. as "lady's fingers" (OKRA) — first, ew, gross, what? Second, isn't "lady's fingers" already taken, as far as foodstuff names are concerned? I thought they were cookies. Don't you soak "lady's fingers" in order to make tiramisu? Yes, ladyfingers (one word) are, in fact, "sponge cake biscuits roughly shaped like large fingers." What is wrong with other countries? Can y'all not just say "OKRA?" Or choose a different body part?
  • 1D: Soup stock in Japanese cuisine (DASHI) — needed a cross or two to jog this culinary term loose from my word horde. ATTA, on the other hand, came to me instantly, as it should to all of you now. Neo-crosswordese. No longer is ["___ boy!"] (or "girl!") the only, or even the primary, cluing option for ATTA.
  • 7D: The Marlins, on scoreboards (MIA) — I always have to stop and think about whether they're FLA or MIA (they used to be FLA).
  • 55D: Left of center? (SOFT C) — a wicked (😎) "letteral" clue. The "c" in "center" is "soft," and it appears on the "left" side of the word (i.e. it's the first letter). Very cryptic.
That's it. Gotta fly....  😎 ... see ya next time.

Signed, Rex Parker, King of CrossWorld

[Follow Rex Parker on BlueSky and Facebook and Letterboxd]
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162 comments:

Anonymous 5:54 AM  

“No one on” is simply wrong, beginning in the 10th, when the innings begin with a man on 2nd. Not in the playoffs, thankfully, but it’s been a gimmick for many years.

Casimir 5:59 AM  

OFL nailed it for me. I pay some attention to popular culture but am not interested in Wicked. So, this was a bit north of medium for me. I liked the defying gravity clues

Anonymous 6:05 AM  

Who the hell is EPAALBH? Classic boy mistake and didn’t read the instructions (66A …singer is spelled by circled letters reading from left to right). Oh, hello EPHALBA! And as a boy, no immediate plans to see Wicked.

Did see Sinners last night, easily top 10 vampire movies of all time. Happy Mischief Eve!

Anonymous 6:07 AM  

Hmm no comment on the OREOS clue. Looks new to me.

Blade 6:22 AM  

I’m ok with “OK, Google” as a counterbalance to the constant barrage of free Apple promotions usually featured in the NYT puzzle.

Gary Jugert 6:28 AM  

Te demandaré.

Phew! Another tough funny one. I really enjoyed the struggle. I am over the top impressed by the architecture of this beauty. Way over my usual time despite knowing ELPHABA and the song. Unfortunately I had HEART first and thought the answer was "Home is where the HEART is." It was much later I understood Home is EARTH. THOSE finally cleared up the mess from ETHOS, but it required me to look up DASHI. I seem to be perpetually being beaten by Asian cooking ingredients in the crossword world. I was nearly done in by BRAND, but it finally relented.

I finished hoping PAMPA was a thing and apparently it's an enormous thing humanoid EARTHlings are destroying. We're so great.

I'd imagine when Dracula wants seafood he eats it right off the batomorph.

Fascinating OKRA trivia today. I've eaten it a few times and it's gross.

If Pop-Pop can't pop his pop, is that a GRAMP cramp?

It took me forever to see NO ONE ON. That's a weird mess of letters.

I wrote in EYE SORE off only the E since I've got a lot of experience being one.

I'll SEE you and I'll SUE you are rudely alike and completely unalike at the same time.

I have a BADGE at work that gets me into doors, but I hardly think of that as authority. Mostly they're just identification, right?

❤️ [Desirable Vegas couple?] HOT WIRE. BOSSY. [Bronzed]. ESCHEWS.

People: 7
Places: 4
Products: 9
Partials: 2
Foreignisms: 2
--
Gary's Grid Gunk Gauge: 24 of 80 (30%)

Funny Factor: 6 😅

Tee-Hee: Animal with a white rump = GARY. And I'm happy to prove I'm right.

Uniclues:

1 What will happen if people don't stay off his lawn.
2 What happened when they found the recording of Ronald Reagan speaking negatively of tariffs.
3 Fish who insist on being just friends.
4 Stayed in the bar drinking mai tais until sunrise.
5 Swipes right.
6 The faster the better in Crosslandia.
7 "Just because I'm pretty doesn't mean you're rich."

1 GRAMP SUE SPREE (~)
2 CANADA BEAMED
3 BOSSY ARO ORCAS
4 GOT A TAN LATER ON
5 ESCHEWS EYE SORE
6 OREOS PACE ETHOS (~)
7 PYRITE IRKED (~)

My Fascinating Crossword Uniclue Keepsake from Last Year: Windows 11. ANTAGONIST'S IOS.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Mark N 6:35 AM  

I am surprised Rex didn't comment on the clue for NO ONE ON. I think he’s a baseball fan and should know that nowadays every extra inning in the regular season starts with one man on second. So the clue, “what every baseball inning starts with” is incorrect. Rex, perhaps you were “bewitched” by the puzzle ;-)

Rex Parker 6:36 AM  

Fair 🙂

Anonymous 6:45 AM  

Hoo boy.

Anonymous 6:53 AM  

Never heard of Wicked and don’t speak Argentinian so found this very hard. Liked the clue for GOT A TAN.

kitshef 7:18 AM  

22A across is, of course, wrong. Every inning from the 10th onwards starts with one on, except in the playoffs. You would think someone who chose to clue MIA with a baseball clue would be aware of that.

Fun fact: the second-longest border is between Russia and Kazakhstan.

The facts that the circled letters do spell something, and that all the themed down answers are valid entries both as displayed and as defined, really raise this puzzle to another level.

Son Volt 7:25 AM  

Whoever thought this deserved publishing should consider another line of work. From the obtuse and puerile theme to the garbage fill - easily in the argument for WPOTY.

I would recommend everyone read @Gary’s elegant reply to @Nancy yesterday at 4:59p - it really summarizes the true foundation of this blog.

REM

Anonymous 7:40 AM  

I mean, I finished it but what the hell was that? Just a silly collection of clues all around. I prefer my crosswords a little more direct and to the point.

Anonymous 7:50 AM  

Rex did an excellent job assessing how difficult this would be for people like me with absolutely 0 knowledge on the theme. Very hard for me!

Anonymous 7:52 AM  

I had surgery on my hand last year. They gave me a block so my whole arm was dead for a full day. I couldn’t take it so I watched wicked as a way to divert the discomfort. I ended up liking it quite a bit. The dance scene was so moving I cried.

43 year old “boy” who likes movies that are moving.

RooMonster 8:01 AM  

Hey All !
Pretty neat puz. Cool animation at completion. Puz was tough-ISH here. Wasn't a breeze-through easy auto-fill. The ole brain was refusing to let me see some things. Silly brain.

Liked that all the transposed Themers were actual words regardless if the first letter was the last letter or the first letter. (Read that again if it made no sense! 😁) Haven't seen the first Wicked yet, had no idea another one was made. Someone's getting rich off the merchandising. Sure as heck ain't me.

Who got close enough to an ELK to see their white ass?
They maybe ended up with an EYESORE.

Have a great Thursday!

Four F's
RooMonster
DarrinV

Gary Jugert 8:02 AM  

Boy o' boy.

Anonymous 8:03 AM  

Agreed. Did not know that was only regular season.

Gary Jugert 8:12 AM  

@Anonymous 7:52 AM
I'm waiting for the second half to be released so I can see both of them at once, but I did see it in the theater and the scene where Defying Gravity is sung is simply one of the greatest things in theater ever. Hand up for another boy crying here. 🙄

Anonymous 8:22 AM  

Did something I never do. I quit. After looking at the completed puzze, I am glad I did. It is just stupid, shame on Will Shortz.

Anonymous 8:24 AM  

"Cameo" is wrong. Def: "a small character part in a play or movie, played by a distinguished actor or a celebrity." Can be announced and often is.

Whatsername 8:24 AM  
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous 8:25 AM  

In no world is it "Gramp." It is only Gramps.

Whatsername 8:26 AM  

Agree re Gary’s thoughtful response to Nancy.

Anonymous 8:27 AM  

Promotional. Boo.

Anonymous 8:31 AM  

42 tower old boy here who also cried at the end when watching the musical on broadway. An amazing experience that really is gender agnostic.

Bob Mills 8:34 AM  

Figured everything out somehow, but it still took forever to hear the music because I had "see" instead of SUE (not knowing TAU as a symbol). "I'll see you" seemed perfect. I strongly disagree with "very easy" as a rating, and I agree with Anonymous 7:40 that it was a mishmash of silly clues.

Andy Freude 8:36 AM  

Here’s another vote for WPOTY. Opened the puzzle, saw the colored circles, and my HEART sank, undefiantly. I’m an Oz fan—love the books, adore the 1939 movie, thought “Wicked” was OK but not interested in the movies. But I like my crossword puzzles neat, no gimmicks. Thanks to Rex for pointing out the clever construction, even if this wasn’t my cup of tea.

Anonymous 8:40 AM  

You nailed it.

Anonymous 8:40 AM  

no interest in wicked or any other 'excuse her for being a villian' unnecessary back story. i like my villians mean for the sake of being mean...cruella, malificient, the wicked witch of the west, etc. let them stand on their villiany!

if you want to do more oz there are 13 other books to choose from.

SouthsideJohnny 8:42 AM  

I’m not at all familiar with the book or movie, but still discerned the theme early on (fortunately). I was also wondering while solving if they kept it super-easy due to the binary PPP theme, (binary is perhaps redundant here, as with most PPP, either you know it or you don’t). If that is the case, I appreciate the fact that it was solvable even if you are not familiar with the theme material.

I actually got a chuckle when I realized that I was attempting to spell ELPHABA, since it doesn’t mean anything to me and doesn’t even look like it could be a person’s name (are witches people too - I guess they are). Oh well. They kept it easy enough that I stuck around for the end. It reminded me of hanging on for the end of a movie that was a little on the boring side, but just good enough that you hang around anyway.

tht 8:53 AM  

Was it "very easy"? "Way, way too easy"? NAW. You'd have to know something about the musical for that to be true. My own experience was one of bafflement at first, but when I saw that something was going on with the cyclic permutations of the letters in the starred clues (which I thought was a pretty neat touch), it got much easier, and for me it wound up being an average Thursday time. So, I give it a Medium.

But still puzzling. ELPHABA just doesn't look like anything plausible to the naked EYE. So I was like the little shrugging figure at the end of Gary Jugert's posts -- glad to get the happy music, but full enlightenment had to wait for LATER ON, after I had a chance to GOOGLE the song DEFYING GRAVITY. (I didn't ask GOOGLE out loud by preceding it with an OK -- see DOC, I have this knee-jerk reaction to the infestation of AI generally, and so I almost always ESCHEW it if I can.)

An impressive architectural feat from the constructor. And I guess from those hardworking NYTXW techno drones as well, but I kinda wish I could get the graphics to stop, because all that motion is making it harder for me to concentrate on the finished result as I write this.

My nerves must be a little sensitive, because this dang cold kept me aWAKE most of the night. And thus it is I find myself pettily IRKED, a little SORE, that Rex told us not once but twice how easy the puzzle is. Sigh. This is despite the fact I KNEW from experience that his posts MEREly reflect his private reactions and need not apply to others, but it just hit me as a little gloaty. That's on me obviously. In reality I am stunned by his ability to discern the theme concept "instantly" (after four answers, which seems like real poverty of evidence) -- does that include the fact that the puzzle was going to be about Wicked? The mind boggles.

That mini-confessional out of the way, I can concentrate on other things. I had trouble with PARAGON -- the word PARAdigm kept getting in my way. I had ROamS before ROVES, which took up some time. I very much liked TOAST, after the ding-ding-ding in my head told me why that particular answer.

How many of you knew TAU stood for 2pi? There's a bit of a debate (a good-natured debate) between mathematicians, whether the quantity TAU, roughly 6.28, should play second fiddle to pi as it has historically. You see 2pi popping up rather more in formulas, for example in writing down the standard Gaussian distribution, or in complex analysis (as in the study of residues). Interestingly, I almost never see TAU appearing in textbooks or articles; whoever is the AD REP (or PADRE) for TAU has fallen down on the job.

Happy Hallowe'ene'en, everyone! That includes you, Les :-)

Jim 9:00 AM  

You know what? F* Wicked, F* Disney, and F* this puzzle.

floatingboy 9:07 AM  

I have gotten close enough to an elk (I have hunted them) and they most definitely DO NOT have white rumps. They are buff colored.

Anonymous 9:09 AM  

SOFTC WTH

Anonymous 9:16 AM  

Came here to post this exact comment

Liveprof 9:17 AM  

Re: BOSSY (53A). Very sorry to learn of the passing of Prunella Scales the actress who played the hilariously bossy Sybil Fawlty, opposite John Cleese's Basil in Fawlty Towers. She was just 5' 3" to his 6' 5" but seemed to loom over him, via her strength of character.

David Grenier 9:17 AM  

This was very much Not In My Wheelhouse. Not only do I know nothing about Wicked aside from it exists, but I knew none of the other trivia or names today either, except for the FLA marlins and that obviously an Argentine plain is a PLAYA and a pencil sharpener goes on a WALL. So yeah, played myself from Jump Street.

I got enough of the revealer from crosses and that helped me figure out what was going on with the theme answers. I didn’t know the name ELPHABA but the themes were mostly easy enough to get on their own. I did appreciate how the theme answers were actual words in their own right.

Thankfully the grid wasn’t full of Wicked references and trivia, so even someone like me could eventually solve it, though how I got past my early stumbles I don’t know.

Gabe 9:17 AM  

As a high school math teacher, I was delighted to see a reference to TAU, but curious how widely known it is?

Anyway, it made me go back and find this delightful Vi Hart video again, which I'd recommend for a curious layperson :)

https://vimeo.com/147792667

pabloinnh 9:29 AM  

My paper copy did no tricks, still haven't seen "Wicked", didn't know the song, but I did just see ELPHABA in a crossword somewhere so that eventually hove into sight. At first I thought the answers with circles were just randomly jumbled so it was nice to see the consistency, which added to the very impressive construction.

LLANO before PAMPA, which always looks funny to me in the singular. SEE before SUE (hi @Gary) and some nits with clues--DRANO doesn't "pull" anything, and are CAMEOs unannounced? Trying to think of synonyms for exemplar and abjures took some thought, but that's good.

My granddaughter has been described by her first grade teacher as BOSSY, but I think if she were a boy it would be "shows leadership skills". Her other grandfather is actually Pop Pop, but I'm not GRAMP, I'm Grampa. Close.

Pretty elegant, HN. It Halloweened Nicely, and thanks for all the fun.

JoePop 9:31 AM  

I might be one of the few baseball fans who actually likes starting extra innings with a runner on second. There's no good reason for games to go 18 innings like a couple of nights ago

Barbara S. 9:32 AM  

I’ve never seen (or read) Wicked, but I know two things about it: 1) it’s about the Wicked Witch of the West, whose name is ELPHABA (derived from L. Frank Baum’s name), and 2) it contains a song entitled DEFYING GRAVITY, which I’ve heard performed a number of times. So, really, those two small bits of info were enough for the purposes of this puzzle. That said, I didn’t have a clue about the theme until I got all the way down to DEFYING GRAVITY. The green suggested nothing, I forgot to try and spell something with the circled squares, and the down answers with no seeming relationship to their clues confused me. But DEFYING GRAVITY fit perfectly in the green row, so – Yay! I went back and looked at both the circles and the nonsensical answers and got it.

PAMPA – know it from Spelling Bee.
OKRA – I’m outside the U.S. and know nothing about a connection to “lady’s fingers.” To me, “lady fingers” are the manual digits of a female aristocrat, or cookies.
ANT – filled in “imp” at first.
ELK (with white rump) – was bummed (as it were) when “white-tailed deer” wouldn’t fit.
SUE – Like others, flirted with “see.”
CANADA BEAMED – Best grid row ever!
TREKS – Break it gently to the Star TREK franchise that TREKS are journeys by foot.
ARO – Love how this trips off the fingers now: new crosswordese that I’ve learned and retained.
ITO – With all that talk of Shere HITE yesterday, I feel Midori ITO should get a shout-out today: both latish twentieth-century female crosswordese.
TOAST – I got this answer but had to look up, after the fact, how “ding, ding, ding” was related to grilled bread. D’oh!
GOT A TAN/MADE A CAMEO – Loved these and hoped they would lead @Rex to EAT A SANDWICH (and they did!).
ESCHEWS, clued with “Abjures” – Two truly excellent words. I try to work ESCHEWS into conversation whenever I can, my best effort coming on a day in early spring when most of the snow had melted and I told my husband as we were leaving the house that I was going to ESCHEW boots (say it out loud).

Thanks to constructor Howard Neuthaler!

Christopher 9:33 AM  

Years later I’m still traumatized from sitting through the stage version of Wicked, the first and only time in a theater I leapt to my feet the moment the music stopped and frantically searched for the nearest exist.

The joke was on me, though, as it was only intermission.

So the nausea was overwhelming as soon as the theme revealed itself in the cluing in the lowest quarter of the grid.

Even during the show I wouldn’t have noticed a song called “Defying Gravity” (was it only in the movie?), but as a theme this could have (and should have) stood alone for more universal appeal.

Even after seeing the green circles filled in I had no idea what the letters meant, and once the answer was explained to me it just made me angry again about the time and money (and time) I wasted on the worst musical I’ve ever seen.

“Too many witch solos,” I noted to m’lady after the whole ordeal was over, but that barely scratched the wretched surface.

egsforbreakfast 9:36 AM  

You ain't heard nuttin' til you've heard an ARO AROAR over his dislike of romance.

With the Ronald Reagan ads coming out of CANADA lately, I would have preferred a theme of DEFYING depRAVITY. I considered a "CANADA BEAMED" joke here, but @Gary Jugert beat me to it. This suggests that minds of some sort think alike and that, contrary to @Gary's 4:59 post of yesterday, someone (me) does read his Uniclues. Further ruminating on @Gary, his revelation that he needs a badge to get into work has me now imagining him working for Lumon Industries, where he no doubt plays a Mark Scout-like role among the severed.

I'll bet I'm not the only one who first thought that reading the circles left to right spelled EPAALBH. I knew this wasn't correct, as EPAALBH was a very minor character in Wicked, whose sole appearance was singing "Obeying Gravity".

I'm thrilled when someone figures out a viable new theme gimmick like this one. Thanks, Howard Neuthaler.

Anonymous 9:43 AM  

Came here to say this, but I wasn't going to wake up 4 hours earlier to be the first to do so.

Doug 9:44 AM  

Legitimately surprised they didn't sit on this puzzle until Thursday, November 20th.

Anonymous 9:44 AM  

How have you not even heard of Wicked?

mmorgan 9:46 AM  

No green in AcrossLite so I missed that, waah. Agree it was easy but I struggled with the bottom left corner.

tht 9:57 AM  

A "c" pronounced like an "s" is called a SOFT C. At the leftmost end of the word "center", we therefore have a SOFT C.

Anonymous 9:57 AM  

Following up on the troll discussion yesterday, I wanted to say thank you to RP and all the moderators for keeping this blog civil. I imagine it’s a fairly tough job, but I very much appreciate those who are willing to do it.

Anonymous 9:58 AM  

I’m only vaguely familiar with the movie and completely unaware of the song name, so did not necessarily have an easy time of it. I did get the floating letters trick pretty quickly though, and thought that was the best part of the theme. Since I didn’t know the singer, the circles meant nothing and since I solve on paper, I had no idea there was anything green. But apparently it was all worthwhile to get the cutesy animation on the app.

It occurred to me that perhaps CANADA BEAMED in pride at the ingenious timing of their Reagan AD.

Anonymous 10:02 AM  

Re: yesterday's discussion about trolls. I'm wondering why this blog allows anonymous comments, like the one I'm doing now. Would removing the ability to post anonymously cut back on trolling? Or is there some value in allowing anon comments that I'm not seeing?

Anonymous 10:02 AM  

People magazine ass puzzle.
Was easy except for all the theme stuff which was just a big shoulder shrug because I know nothing about Wicked, and don’t really care to if I’m being forthright. So, yeah, some fanfic musical isn’t really my thing so this one passed me by. Upwards and onwards

tht 10:03 AM  

I won't enter the link because Vi Hart is just a little too frenetic for my taste. (Although her content is generally good.) I assume she's on Team TAU, not Team pi.

jberg 10:10 AM  

Unless you're making gumbo, try slicing your okra thinly and frying it with spices until it's crispy. It loses all the gooiness, and tastes great.

tht 10:14 AM  

@Anon 9:44AM. No need to put down the earlier Anon. If you (in the abstract) live in states near NYC, and watch network television, then of course you will have been inundated by ads for Broadway productions of Wicked. But maybe some people don't have a TV and don't pay attention to musicals.

jberg 10:14 AM  

Way more than 13. After Baum died his daughter wrote a whole bunch more.

Dr Random 10:20 AM  

I guess as a relatively new (two years) solver, I’m likely to appreciate Rex’s easy-level Thursdays—gimmicks that don’t leave me hopeless for figuring out without at least some kind of help. I got a bit of a rush, working all over the grid, never having seen Wicked or knowing anything about its songs or character names, when it all came together. I didn’t have a single of the theme answers, but suddenly I had enough crosses to wonder if “DEFYING GRAVITY” might be the name of the song (it’s at least a familiar phrase, so that part of the theme works without knowing the film), and looked back up to see if that could make sense of the fragments I had of the other answers…and then it all came together. My take away: I’m glad there are occasional Thursdays that play too easy for experienced solvers, because it’s a pleasure for a newb/noob to get the chance to solve a gimmick puzzle.

pabloinnh 10:25 AM  

Argentinian?

Anonymous 10:26 AM  

Frankly. Ha ha!

Les S. More 10:30 AM  

Well, people here are always saying they hate circles. They hate shaded squares. They hate coloured graphics. So what went through the collective mind of the NYTXW cabal to induce them to include all three? Not to mention answers that, as printed, don’t fit the clues.

In your face, prissy, rule-bound solver!

I actually quite liked it. Took me a few minutes to catch on. I tried just spelling EASEL backwards at 29D (cuz I had ELK) and, when crosses wouldn’t work, started fooling about with it. I was in no hurry and when I anagrammed EASEL to LEASE and made some crosses work the game was, as they say, afoot. I then jumped down to the 66A area, got a couple of the downs and, off the YI and VI plopped in DEFYING GRAVITY, which is just crazy amazing because I am not a big “musical guy”. But I have seen the show. On Broadway. I do get out once in a while.

Several years ago my wife and I took our 3 sons and their girlfriends to Manhattan for Xmas and New Year celebrations. Two of those girlfriends are now daughters-in-law and one has, thankfully, decamped. We did all the required downtown NYC things like MoMA and the Metropolitan Museum (and I dragged them to the Frick and the Whitney, too), Central Park in the snow, the Natural History Museum, as well as some off-track things like the Tenement Museum on the Lower East Side. And shows! Did I mention that I’m not really a big fan of musicals? But I loved Wicked. Mostly because of the story. I remember liking the music but I don’t actually remember the music. Not the tunes, not the titles.But I dropped in DEFYING GRAVITY with very little help. My brain is a very strange place.

So, a lot of fun here with only two negative things on my note pad: GRAMP at 36A. It’s Grampa or, if you’re a bit more formal, Grandpa. Or maybe it’s Gramps, but not GRAMP. Sounds like something painful. And DRANO doesn’t pull things. It dissolves them.

Thanks, Howard Neuthaler. I enjoyed this.

jberg 10:31 AM  

I could tell something was going on. I even peaked ahead at the revealer clue, which didn't help. At one point I thought we were supposed to translate THOSE into Spanish, which I thought might be EstOS (my Spanish isn't very good), but that didn't work. I slowly worked my way to the bottom, where DEFYING seemed to be emerging, and remembered that there had been another puzzle within the last month or so with DEFYING GRAVITY as an answer. That helped a lot, and I eventually figured out just how the defiance worked. Whew!

For some reason I always think Wicked was written by Roald Dahl. I've corrected myself on this before, but it didn't stick. Maybe this time.

@Pablo, despite my poor Spanish, I too questioned PAMPA. I've been to and read a lot about Argentina, but never see anything but PAMPAs. But I realize that here at home we have the Great Plains, but still recognize the singular, so OK.

I did like the crossing of PC file extensions, .PDFS/.DOCS.

I didn't know about that runner-on-second gimmick; but my first answer there was NOne out, which fit the clue better.

I did finish, despite knowing little of Wicked except the basic plot device; but I confess I had to look up the Marlins to see where they were from (not to mention what sport they played).

Rex Parker 10:37 AM  

Not everyone has or wants a Google account. Yes in a perfect world everyone would be verified, because yes anonymity makes meanness easier, but most anonymous comments are fine, the truly bad ones get deleted, and if anons can sometimes run contrarian or even antagonistic, I think that’s generally healthy for a comments section. If anonymous comments can skew toward snark, just think of it as a counterbalance to the “clubhouse” effect of a comments section, which can feel very insiders-only and can reinforce a kind of uniformity of thought. I am happy to tolerate dissent and even mild hostility (even toward myself, lord knows) in the spirit of entertaining different opinions and personalities. I think I’m done letting meta-conversations about comments flourish, though, for now. Thanks for reading—back to the puzzle. 😊

Richard 10:39 AM  

In the Times print edition Oreo appears twice on the same page and both in the “Crossword” column: Once singular without the “s” as a "milkshake ingredient", and a second time plural with the “s” as "dessert sandwiches", once in the “Answer for the Previous Puzzle”, and the second time in today’s puzzle.

Rex Parker 10:40 AM  

🙏

Whatsername 10:45 AM  
This comment has been removed by the author.
Teedmn 10:49 AM  

I kind of read the clue for 56A (i.e. skipped most of it) and for some reason translated "Wicked" into "Frozen". Apparently in my brain all musicals mentioned in a grid are "Frozen". I haven't seen "Wicked," the Broadway musical nor the movie but I did read the book it was all based on so ELPHABA was known to me. I didn't rearrange which musical was being discussed until I saw ELPHABA post-solve. I suppose it should have occurred to me to wonder why "Frozen" would have a song titled "DEFYING GRAVITY".

With OK_OO____ in the grid, I had to wonder if questions to one's smart device often began as OK bOOmer.

I got the theme trick at KRONA/AKRON and the rest fell easily. I refuse to think of OREOS as dessert. Snack or sweet but if that's all I'm getting for dessert, I will be sad.

Howard Neuthaler, thanks for the Thursday puzzle.

Danny 10:50 AM  

I’m LOVING the term “gender agnostic.” Thank you for that.

Hack mechanic 10:50 AM  

Haven't seen the shows/movies but did read the book. Of course put the letters in wrong at first, but elk straightened that out. Got the song from crosses book being no help at all & got stuck till the other part of the theme dawned. Wouldn't say "very easy" at all!!

Charlie S 10:50 AM  

This puzzle wasn't exactly my cup of tea, but I think the hate on it here feels excessive. I'm not too familiar with Wicked, but my girlfriend loves it and it felt like a major event last year, so I'm at least familiar with DEFYING GRAVITY and ELPHABA. Even so, I filled in all the themers (except the revealer) and got the gimmick that you put the last letter at the front before even looking at the revealer and learning that it's a Wicked puzzle. And I also was familiar with DEFYING GRAVITY as a kid who wasn't into musicals, well before the movie came out last year, and I feel like that's a pretty iconic song. So all in all a very gettable puzzle even if you're not a Wicked aficionado. And the green is fun!!

That being said, I feel like only one letter of each themer really defies gravity, rather than the themers themselves, but ah well. What are you gonna do. Obviously the fill isn't great and that's more of a concern.

As a math lover, my hill to die on here is "26D: Symbol for the ratio of a circle's circumference to its radius". C = 2pi*r. The ratio is 2pi, by definition. What on earth is TAU doing here???? We had to use another greek letter to mean 2pi???? I see TAU in this context has its own wikipedia page, and that some mathematicians have advocated for using TAU (2pi) instead of pi to make the calculations feel more natural, but man, in all my time learning math, not once has that come up. Seems pretty fringe. TAU has showed up 362 times in NYTXW, and this is the first time it's ever been clued in this wonky way (and hopefully the last!)

Anonymous 10:51 AM  

Is it the *puzzle* that is stupid, or…?

Anonymous 10:51 AM  

This is why I had “none out” for the longest time.

Whatsername 10:51 AM  

This was me … darn Blogger glitched … again.

jb129 10:53 AM  

Sorry but I agree with @SonVolt 7:25
WPOTY. And I really needed a pleasant, enjoyable diversion on this rainy, gloomy day :(

Whatsername 10:54 AM  

This was also me. (Sigh)

mathgent 10:57 AM  

If I had been able to get some of the seven themers from the crosses, I might have been able to see the gimmick, i.e. put the first letter last. But no. Totally bombed it.

Anonymous 10:58 AM  

Hi everyone!  Constructor here.  Copying a comment I just made on the NYT Wordplay column:
I was hesitant to comment because I don't want people to see that I'm reading these and be discouraged to comment negatively if that's how they're inclined!
Anyway, as many of you know, NYT typically changes about half of a puzzle's clues, which is roughly what they did here.  As always, I think most of their changes made the puzzle much better!  That said, a couple of notes you may find interesting:
--I didn't expressly reference "Wicked" at all in my cluing, as I wanted to (a) accommodate solvers who knew nothing of it, and (b) have the circled letters be an easter egg for whose who did.  I just had the theme answers and circles in green, suggested the animation, and clued DEFYING GRAVITY as "Refusing to obey ... or what the circled letters are doing that makes the starred clues seem to not match their answers."
--My clue for NOONEON was "Empty bags?".  I certainly *do* know my baseball, and although the final clue was not mine, I should have caught its inaccuracy when I reviewed the NYT proof.
Thanks to all of you for doing the puzzle and commenting -- I appreciate all of them, positive and negative!

Anonymous 11:07 AM  

One qualification. Yes, the clue is incorrect insofar as the MLB is concerned. So point taken, But, prominent and dominant as the professional version sponsored by the MLB may well be, the MLB rules are an aberration. For the many millions of other people around the world who play baseball, the clue is correct.

Les S. More 11:09 AM  

@egs. I too immediately associated the BADGE with Lumon. @Gary, when you look in the mirror, do you see Adam Scott?

Greater Fall River Committee for Peace & Justice 11:09 AM  

No green in the paper paper. But I did find DEFYING GRAVITY which opened up the whole bottom for me, and I eventually got the top too. My one interesting WICKED experience was last December when I was putting together my annual post-Christmas Messiah sing, and somebody in my church suggested I do a Wicked Sing instead; that would really draw the crowds in, she thought. I can sing the Messiah because I've worked at it for decades, and done serious amounts of vocal technical exercises. I don't think I could sing Defying Gravity. Do most people up on pop culture think they can? Would anyone want to listen to them try?

Anonymous 11:11 AM  

Exactly. I’ve thought the same thing. I live in the Apple walled garden and I’ve been happy there, but I’ve been looking over the wall at Samsung’s phones because of Apple CEO’s bringing a gold bar to President. Huh? A Korean company like Samsung… that’s hopefully another story. Sorry to get political and rant. For me, VERY hard puzzle. Don’t know Wicked and never got the gimmicks. Clean tub with a loof? Liked the refreshing Oreo clue though.

Anonymous 11:17 AM  

I don't know Wicked. For me, this was the toughest Thursday puzzle in AGES. Lots of tricky clues, things I didn't know...I usually finsih Thursdays in 5-7 minutes, this was 15.

tht 11:18 AM  

If it were a single "ding", then I would have thought it was the TOASTer going off. But three dings? That has to be something else trying to get my attention. :-) Terrific clue.

Les S. More 11:22 AM  

Very strong, very supportable position. Especially the reference to the "clubhouse" effect. Thanks Rex.

Anonymous 11:26 AM  

At ceremony yesterday for a farmer friend I bumped into a staffer of a "rigpublican" state legislator, recounted a text I sent to the man who farms my place: MAGA now stands for make Argentina great again. The room full of soy bean farmers quieted down for a long 15 seconds

Nancy 11:26 AM  

I was extremely touched and gratified by the outpouring of so many of your voices yesterday urging me not to leave the blog. Letting me know how much you enjoy reading my comments. After all that warmth and affection, how could I possibly leave?

But on the same comments page yesterday was the jaw-dropping Schadenfreude of Rex at 12:41 and 12:43 -- making clear that my troll had not slipped under his radar by means of clever subtlety, but had been purposely allowed to bully me for months on maybe 15 or more occasions because Rex didn't feel the abuse directed at me was abusive enough. That the comments were "mild". That I should suck it up and deal with it, just as he does. And that if I can't deal with that, well too bad for me.

I cannot continue to stay on a blog where the blogmeister gets to decide how much abuse I should be required to take, who deliberately opts not to protect me from it, and who refuses to let me defend myself. I prefer to live a snark-free life, thank you very much -- and once I'm off this blog, I shall.

But how to reconcile these two conflicting desires: stay for the benefit of your blog pals or leave for your own happiness and a snark-free life. I woke up at 2:30 in the morning with what I was sure was the answer. Eureka!!

What if every morning when I finish the puzzle, I go not to the Rexblog page, but to my own email account? What if I write my comment exactly as I would write it for the blog, but instead send it in a group email to all the people who say they enjoy reading me? (I can continue to read other people's comments on the blog, just never post myself.)

So this morning, I went to yesterday's blog and made a list of all the people who said complimentary things and urged me to stay. And what I discovered, alas, is that I don't have as many of their email addresses as I thought I had. To specify:

Addresses I already have: @Mathgent, @Whatsername, @Beezer, @jae, @jberg, and @Gary J. Addresses I was able to look up on the person's profile: @CDilly, @Greater Fall River.

Email addresses I don't have and that aren't listed: @tht, @SFR, @Les S. More, @egsforbreakfast, @dgd, @Southside Johnny, @Masked and Anonymous, @Liveprof, @beverly c, and @Unknown.

And then there were all the lovely Anons, more than a dozen, I think, who added their voices -- and obviously I don't have their emails. But I am no less grateful to them than to anyone else and wish I could include them.

I don't have my own email listed precisely because of the troll problem online. It's one thing to have to leave the Rexblog and it's quite another to have to abandon your own email account. I fully understand everyone's decision not to list their own address. Especially the women.

But any of you I've mentioned by blog name who has an off-blog relationship with someone who has your address and is also known to me, please ask them to pass it along. I would love to include you in a group email.

I do want to especially thank the Anon, the therapist, who posted at 11 p.m. yesterday. He says -- and he's a professional -- that ignoring bullies doesn't work, that it only indicates acceptance of and submission to the bullying, and that it's very bad advice to give children. Thank you, Anon 11:00 p.m. Personally, I have always thought that the four dumbest words ever to be found online are "Don't Feed the Trolls."

tht 11:28 AM  

I didn't know it was the first time TAU was clued like that. I think pi is here to stay, so not to worry about this interloper TAU, but the tau camp does have some points in its favor. In an alternative history, the area inside a circle is tau/2 times the radius squared, and what on earth is that pi doing there???? We had to use another Greek letter to mean tau/2???? :-)

Anonymous 11:37 AM  

FWIW, I don't know Wicked at all and enjoyed solving and the theme in spite of that. Well done.

Carola 11:40 AM  

Getting the gravity-defying loofa-->ALOOF early helped the rest of the puzzle go quickly. Sadly, even though I saw a touring production of Wicked just a few months ago, I have no recollection of DEFYING GRAVITY - that had to come entirely from crosses. Happily, my mental decline stopped short of my forgetting ELPHABA's name and that she's green.

pabloinnh 11:46 AM  

I'm sure PAMPA exists in the wild. Probably "scruple" does too, I've just never heard anyone say them.

Anonymous 11:46 AM  

I would have preferred the "defying gravity" clues to have double meanings. For example, Heart -> Earth actually works for the clue "Your home" (i.e. Home is where the heart is.)

But what does Akron have to do with Swedish money, or Padres with commercial time? Those clues just seem a bit lazy.

Carola 12:01 PM  

Thank you for commenting! and for the back story on those two clues. I think "Empty bags?" is great - but also hard! This said by someone who doesn't follow baseball at all. And I see your point about leaving "Wicked" out of the clueing, but I'm terrible at any sort of online Easter egg hunt and guess that I'd have tried to make sense of E-P-A-A-L-B-H :) So I was glad to have the directions.

SouthsideJohnny 12:02 PM  

It’s always nice when the constructor stops by. Thanks for taking the time to pay us a visit. It’s a little weird that the NYT misfired on such an easy clue/answer combo. It’s something that I’ve never been able to get my arms around - we probably see about one cluing mistake a week in the NYT grids. I do the puzzles in four or five of the other major publications daily, and I don’t think I see one bogus clue a month in all of them combined. It defies logic.

Yesterday I learned from Rex that there is a lot more going on behind the scenes when running a blog forum like this than one might realize. Perhaps the same can be said regarding crosswords at the Old Gray Lady - but the other outlets don’t seem to fazed by it and manage to consistently get things right. One of life (and CrossWorld’s) small mysteries I suppose.

I wish Will S. would agree to substitute host, or co-host with Rex sometime. That would be a real treat.

Anonymous 12:03 PM  

Rarely read the comments, but had to make sure this was brought up…thx!

jb129 12:07 PM  

Thank YOU, Howard for your response. It's nice to hear back from constructors. And I take it back - it's NOT WPOFY :)

Anonymous 12:15 PM  

Frozen and Wicked both have Idina Menzel (aka Adele Dazeem) belting the show stopping number. So maybe that subconscious connection was there.

SouthsideJohnny 12:16 PM  

Hi Nancy. I added my contact email to my profile. I’d love to be included in your group email distribution list.

Jnlzbth 12:16 PM  

Had to cheat to get from "I'll see you" to "I'll SUE you" and tae to TAU. But it felt good to get all the rest of the puzzle after a slow start.

Not sure how I feel about the singular GRAMP instead of Gramps. But I appreciate that the gravity-defying answers make words two ways. And I love having ESCHEWS in the puzzle. Nice clue for OREO, too (Small dessert sandwiches). All in all, a fun Thursday. Thanks, Howard!

Anonymous 12:18 PM  

Thank you for your work! Tastes will vary (for myself, I loved it) but I don’t think anyone could be unimpressed (how’s that for a double negative) with the construction itself. Words that remain words when letters are moved to the back? Well done!

pabloinnh 12:21 PM  

Please add me to your group email. Meant to comment yesterday. Thanks.

Duke Nukem 12:24 PM  

I don’t think it’s a “put down” to ask someone how they haven’t heard of one of the most famous musicals and recently Oscar nominated extremely successful movies. Just normal conversation.

Jnlzbth 12:35 PM  

Rex, that's a very good reply and I agree with your outlook. Thanks.

Jnlzbth 12:41 PM  

"Empty bags" is such a good clue! Too bad they changed it. Thanks for your comments!

Anonymous 12:48 PM  

Fun and easy solve, with only a little resistance in the upper middle. Getting PENNAME caused it to dissolve. Like DRANO. Haha. I don’t really get all the salt, I found this puzzle to be cute and enjoyable with a fun theme and gimmick, if quite a bit easy for a Thursday.

In the past, I was a moderator for a large online fitness community. It is a relatively thankless task, but we find our joys here and there. The tiny dramas are always amusing, as are the overinflated egos they bring. I have found the balance of moderation here to be quite deft so I suppose I wanted voice my appreciation for the consideration required to cultivate a group of admins who can manage that kind of consistency. Keep up the good work, Rex.

Anonymous 12:48 PM  

LOL !!! Could not agree more!!!

Anonymous 1:07 PM  

So he’s deeply unfair and cruel and yet published your comment— in which you abuse him and attempt to take other commenters with you on your big resignation? And he let all those pro-Nancy comments through—because he hates you? And ~he~ is the bad guy? Ok

tht 1:18 PM  

But Duke, how is one to reply to a question of the form "How is it you've never heard of this thing?"

"I don't know, I guess I'm just ignorant/stupid. What can I say?"

It's a rhetorical question, I guess, and it's not hard to see how it could make the person feel bad, I don't think.

okanaganer 1:22 PM  

@Rex 10:37 am: nicely stated!

Rex Parker 1:24 PM  

True. I get “I can’t believe you haven’t heard of” comments regularly and I never know what to say. 🤷🏻 believe it! FELIX Frankfurter for instance! More than one comment/email admonishing me for my ignorance. And yet .. I assume most people who talk that way are being good natured about it. With Online discourse we tend to supply tone and context that isnt there (or isn’t explicit) based on our fears or anxieties. But still, you’re right, it can feel personal.

okanaganer 1:32 PM  

The theme was pretty much wasted on me as I have not:
- seen the movie,
- heard of ELPHABA,
- heard the song.
But I did get the "rising letter" trick, so that was something!

I was shocked by the comment from the constructor, that his version of the puzzle did not mention the movie in the clues!

I was led astray by MIA (surely it's FLA?) and, right below it, TAU instead of 2PI! Math was my best subject but I don't remember using tau for that at all.

AnonymousSteve 1:32 PM  

Elphaba's lady fingers actually do look like OKRA.

Whatsername 1:35 PM  

Sounds like a plan, Nancy and I definitely want to be on that mailing list.

Anonymous 1:41 PM  

This is from Nancy. Thank you, both @Southside and @pablo -- I will be delighted to add both of you to my email list. Indeed, I already have.

Interestingly, after all these years, I find myself unable to access the Rexblog with my name -- only as an "Anonymous". Since I don't believe in coincidences, the fact that this happened today of all days makes me believe that this is Rex's Revenge. "You're going to leave this blog???!!!!! Well, I'll teach you a lesson!!!!"

Wonder what everyone else thinks? NAW, don't answer that. Rex, like Trump, may have an enemies list and why should you get yourselves on it for no good reason? If in the future I have to post as Anonymous, I'll always tell you at the top who I am. Meanwhile, I'll see a bunch of you in the near future in a group email. I'm going to wait a bit to see who else wants to be added. And then, not being the most tech-savvy person on the planet, it may take me a while to work out the logistics of having all those names on top, while leaving myself enough room to write a comment. Perhaps I'll need to break the list into two parts and send two emails each day -- don't know yet.

But I WILL be doing this. Once I set it up, however long that takes, my intention is to then do it every day.

I'll begin with an introductory group email that doesn't contain a comment -- sent just to establish the names on the group list and the "Reply All" function. After that, even Luddite me should be able to carry on without too much, if any difficulty. Fingers crossed:)

See you soon, I hope.

Whatsername 1:44 PM  
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous 1:57 PM  

“Like Trump” it’s stunning none of your alleged friends will tell you you”’re behaving badly Nancy. Do you all who like her so much really think he has an enemies list, that he’s punishing Nancy? Unwarranted. Slanderous. Unhinged.

Les S. More 2:01 PM  

I appreciate that, tht. Since moving to our small farm about 4 years ago, I haven't seen a single trick-or-treater. I miss that part. The smiling, hopeful kids telling you about their costumes while you dole out the candy. It's a long way from the road to our house and much of it is unlit.

What I don't miss is the celebration of gore that used to take place every October in my old suburban neighbourhood. Gravestones with bony hands reaching out of the earth near them, facsimile corpses covered in fake blood, effigies hanging in trees, that sort of thing. Otherwise rational people trying to out-macabre each other.

So, yeah, I miss the excited kids but not so much the carried away "adults" and I look forward to November first when I can buy up a bunch of sale priced peanut butter cups.

Happy Hallowe'en to you, too.

Bob Mills 2:03 PM  

Foe okanaganer and others: MIA is correct. The team changed its identity several years ago from Florida Marlins to Miami Marlins.

Anonymous 2:08 PM  

I don't believe Rex ever engages in Schadenfreude. I understand your frustration and even your decision to leave, but there's no point in engaging in any more Rex bashing. Leave the blog if that's your decision, but let the rest of us enjoy it.

Anonymous 2:27 PM  

Amen. Go Jays!!

Anonymous 2:27 PM  

I wish I could "like" your comment. NOONEON irked me--I assumed it must be a clue written before the MLB started the designated runner thing. I'm even more irked now that I've learned that this was the clue's debut. It's simply wrong!

Masked and Anonymous 2:29 PM  

ELPHABA witch ... nice Halloween Eve offerin. Also, very cool puztheme mcguffin. Downright OPRIM.

16x15 puzgrid with E/W symmetry. Different. Like.

staff weeject pick: TAU. Its double-servin-of-PI meanin is sure news to this olde math major and calculus teacher. None of my math teachers ever TAU-ed m&e that.

Only no-know troubles: ARO. ELPHABA. DASHI. TAU as clued. soooo ... pretty smoooth solvequest, for a ThursPuz. Especially since I caught onto the butt-letters-risin dealie, before real long.

some fave stuff: OKGOOGLE. MAKEACAMEO clue. RAY = bat-morph's batty clue. PADRE bein used to scrub the tubs.

Thanx for yer gravity-defyin performance, Mr. Neuthaler dude.
Made my HEART dizzy. Day-um wicked job.

Masked & AnonymoUs

... and now, for a mini-nourishin Halloween Eve "treat" ...

"Spooked by Design" - 7x7 themed runt puzzle:

**gruntz**

Spooky M&A

Lester 2:31 PM  

I saw a stage production of Wicked too many years ago to remember Defying Gravity, but when I see that title (which I think has shown up, at least as a clue, in crosswords before), Jesse Winchester’s song by that name starts going through my mind, and it’s a lovely earworm to have. I recommend that you check it out -- especially Pablo in NH (If you and your group don't already sing Jesse's music, I think you'll be delighted to discover it.), Jesse's best album, IMHO, is Third Down, 110 to Go, whose name reflects the circumstance that Jesse went to CANADA to avoid being drafted into the Vietnam war.

ChrisS 2:40 PM  

Anon 11:07, the automatic runner also applies to minor league baseball and to college baseball. These are versions seen by way more people than play/watch other levels of baseball. The answer is wrong. The rest of the puzzle is fine. PS are you the constructor, this comment seems a bit defensive.

okanaganer 2:59 PM  

@Les 2:01 pm, I wish I could send you some trick or treaters. I'm in an older post war neighborhood that's a real hotbed of trick or treating. We actually have vans full of kids coming in from wherever... the countryside, the Indian Reserve, etc. Hundreds and hundreds!

Anonymous 3:01 PM  

I have heard about Wicked and even watched the first 15 minutes of the movie online and hated it. So all the clues went over my gray head, although I figured out the DEFYING GRAVITY clues, after Googling the song title. (I had -E-ING in 66-across.) . But overall, not a pleasant experience and far from easy.

Les S. More 3:11 PM  

@Jim. Wicked is not the problem. It was, in my non-musical-guy opinion, a pretty good Broadway production. But Disney ... yeah, I'm leery. Don't appreciate how they have bought up just about everything. Haven't seen the movie. Worried about what Walt's gang will do to it. But the puzzle, if you ignore the movies and focus on the play, wasn't bad,

gharris 3:12 PM  

Nancy, please add me to your mailing.

ChrisS 3:13 PM  

How do you know this anonymous that trolled you is one person? Aren't they anonymous? Not sure it matters, just curious. Farewell.

Anonymous 3:14 PM  

I definitely distinguish “I haven’t heard of X” from “X isn’t well known enough to merit NYTXW.” I agree that, regardless of tone, a “you haven’t heard of X?” response goes nowhere. I appreciate when responses to “I haven’t heard of X” make the case of the cultural relevancy of the answer, as no one can know all subcultures but being aware of communities outside of your own experience broadens your understanding of society at large.

ChrisS 3:18 PM  

99% agree that okra is gross. However just back from NOLA and it was a side, deep fried, at a wonderful restaurant and I liked it. Restaurant is Saint Claire, off the beaten path on the west bank.

ChrisS 3:30 PM  

Good puzzle, and lots of gods info in your post. Wow, half of your clues get changed, never would have guessed that high. From now on I will mentally blame Will Shortz for all bad clues.

tht 3:33 PM  

AKRON doesn't have anything to do with Swedish money, except for the fact that when you move the first letter to the end, you get KRONA. All the starred theme answers work that way. Similarly, PADRE becomes AD REP which is the actual answer that matches the down clue. Rex gives more details in his write-up.

pabloinnh 3:34 PM  

Didn't know this one but it's lovely and I'll add it to my big old binder. I was introduced to JW not long ago by a friend who played "Sham-A-Ling-Dong-Ding" and I looked it up on youtube and it blew me away.

Thanks for the recommendation.

PS-Don't sing with a group any more, just a partner.

Paul 3:41 PM  

Beisbol factoid I didn't know.

jae 3:45 PM  

Easy-medium.

I pay enough attention to pop culture to know the song, although I do not plan on seeing the movie.

DASHI was my only WOE and fla before MIA was it for costly erasures.

Impressive construction with a reasonably smooth grid, liked it.

Anonymous 3:46 PM  

Well said. I don't read the comments for drama, I read them for understanding the things I might have missed in the puzzle. Say your piece and sit down.

My old Torts professor didn't like slander or libel. "What do think BACKS were made for ?"

Anonymous 4:10 PM  

I have not seen wicked but was able to solve without googling, except for SHUE!
Clever puzzle, nicely done.
Don’t leave, Nancy - this too shall pass.

tht 4:14 PM  

@Les My mom, formerly an artist (mainly sculpture -- she hung up her tools some time ago), used to have fun every Halloween doing something dastardly to the poor mannequin that for some reason we had inside our house. It could be a butcher knife stabbing one year, a hanging the next. The kiddos would come to our door and see the results inside, but I don't think anyone was traumatized by the sight. We didn't live in one of these neighborhoods where everyone was competing for Halloween recognition, so she was pretty sui generis in that respect. (It was a fun house to grow up in.)

Since she worked a lot in stone, we also had some uninscribed gravestones sitting around in our back yard, but I don't think we commandeered those for the occasion.

Anonymous 4:23 PM  

Untrue. Every single time I try to post a view contrary to Democrats or Liberals, it never gets posted. A counterpoint to all this Left would be nice, but is never seen.

Anonymous 4:47 PM  

"What do you think BACKS were made for ?"

Anonymous 4:57 PM  

I give it up for the constructor. Kudos.

Gary Jugert 5:13 PM  

@egsforbreakfast 9:36 AM

Laying on the floor shivering. Staring at the ceiling. Thoughts whirring. {Am I starting to think like @egs? Am I? Surely not. Shirley nawt.}

-The old argon sign died so I need to buy a NOO NEON.

-When you pickle a prosecutor, you CAN A DA.

-Instead of eating a sandwich, I can rent myself out to Big Pharma and BE A MED.

-One who gets hot and bothered over double PI is a TAU HOE.

-After being fired 24 times, I'm now on BOSS Y who is Gen Z ... there's some DEF Y-ING, eh?

-GPA enhancers in Mordor are ORC AS.

-I wrote an ode to my GPS, it's called TO A ST.

-Every Thanksgiving I GRAVY IT.

-Inkers on the road GO TATAN.

-McDonald's buried their clown and we all weeped for the LATE RON.

-It's too much work telling people I give my dog Snausages, so I just tell them I use ES CHEWS.

-When I see a golden girl who GOT A TAN, for me, it's EYES ORE, and when they look back at me the ORE O'S.

-I bought a Maytag after having a BAD GE.

-I'm thinking of taking up painting, but I don't think I'm going to be very good, so rather than invest I'm just going to do an EASEL LEASE.

-That baseball clue was dead on arrival and I think we should PYRE IT.

-Pirate superlatives are ARR ESTS and pirate AIGNS are ARR AIGNS.

-If you listen carefully you can HEAR T in your EAR th.

-When I want feathers from a robot, I say OK GOOGLE, PENNA ME.

-Everytime I sing out of tune in the bathroom, I think, "A LOO FA, BE SO RAY."

-You don't need Modern London if there's NO TATE.

-According to SOFT C, B RAN D, ME, AN T.

-Gotta make an OK O face for this puzzle: OREO, ARO, CAMEO, CAIRO.

-When composer Jule gets an EYE SORE, it's a STYNE STYE.

Okay, phew, I think nothing like the masterful @egs. But I am worried I missed OF AGE in my tee-hee-ery today.

Carola 5:48 PM  

Hi @Nancy, I've been away from home the past couple of days and only now caught up on the blog postings. I'm sorry you're leaving the blog and will miss your comments.

CDilly52 5:57 PM  

Hand up for NOne out because of the regular season rule change to putting a base runner on in the 10th. Hate that rule but whaddaya gonna do.

Anonymous 6:04 PM  

Didnt like Wicked at all. The one who played Elphaba looked like Yoda to me .

Anonymous 6:06 PM  

No one on is the way it should be.. and while I'm on it; I like umpires calling balls and strikes.. so they make some mistakes.../ errors. We all do..even shortstops!

Gary Jugert 6:39 PM  

@Gabe 9:17 AM
Great video.

Anonymous 6:45 PM  

It's called ITB for international tie breaker. Last batter out in the previous inning starts at second. Also used in fast pitch softball.

Anonymous 6:57 PM  

Anonymous 8:24 AM
Make a cameo unannounced? Question mark tells you the clue is not a definition. Clue close enough for crosswords. Anyway , when Hitchcock made his cameo appearances in his movies he was most definitely unannounced in the movie.

Pondie 7:05 PM  

I emailed one of Nancy's contacts earlier today, who will forward my message & email. Thanks, @whatsername, you hadn't posted yet. Nancy is a valuable contributor to this space who is sometimes more tolerant than I would be. (Though I love the splats.) I hope to get on her email blast.
Like Nancy, I have zero interest in pop culture and haven't seen a movie in ~15 years, but I did this one in a bit more than my average time. I have a problem with DRANO and GRAMP, but never mind. There's always something. Classical music and opera is my thing.

Anonymous 7:30 PM  

Nancy, your thin skin is mystifying. Your comments over the years have never spared the snark when it comes to criticizing puzzles and constructors. If you can dish it out, you should be prepared to take it.

GranK 9:09 PM  

Nancy: please add me to your list.

Anonymous 10:07 PM  

I can see editing the clues, but to tear the voice of the constructor away, because you think you have better clues? That is just wrong. Shortz' baloney "degree" in "Enigmatology", or whatever he calls it, shouldn't make him the King of cluing. Remember, No Kings! The puzzles would be much better with most, if not All, of the constructors clues.

Anonymous 10:12 PM  

I saw the Wicked stage show, the story was cute, but the music forgettable.

Lester 10:41 PM  

Thanks, Pablo. While you're at it, check out Glory to the Day. I used it as the background music for the slide show at my brother's memorial. It was heart-wrenching and totally fitting. A most beautiful way to remember my dear brother.

Anonymous 10:49 PM  

Agree wholeheartedly

Jim 1:06 AM  

Along with the Greek and NATO alphabets, one must know the characters, plotlines, and songs of Wicked to do a NYT puzzle. Also all Apple products, past and present.

CDilly52 1:37 AM  

LOL re OKRA ! It’s a given that if the word OKRA comes up in conversation, there will be opinions. 51 years ago I married an Okie from Norman. I grew up in Columbus OH, so we immediately had football compatibility issues. When - as all folks who grew up in Norman seem to do - he wanted to go back home, we moved from Champagne-Urbana (go Illini!) to Norman. The first thing my father-in-law asked me (he’d been bragging about my cooking to his family) was “Honey, can you make a Chicken-fried steak and OKRA?” I only knew OKRA in gumbo where it also loses the slime and couldn’t believe people would just eat it plain! Turns out to an Oklahoman, just like “tea” means “cold tea” (not “iced tea”) or “sweet tea” (also “cold” ) OKRA means coated with corn meal and fried. Never learned to cook a decent chicken fry or OKRA, I only drink “hot tea” and fried OKRA is merely tolerable; I’ll eat it to be polite if it is served to me unrequested. We resolved our football issues unless OSU played the Sooners. Then it was a house divided. We were in Columbus on September 24,1977 with my parents (both OSU alums) for “The Kick” as it is known in Norman (and elsewhere) when Uwe von Schamann in the last second kicked that field goal and OU beat OSU in that first meeting 29-28. Larry called his dad when we got home. His dad reminded me I lost our bet and had to eat a whole plate of OKRA. Brutal.

CDilly52 2:25 AM  

I am a huge fan of the books, not a fan of the movie but did enjoy the Broadway stage production. It was able to bring some of the darkness of the books to life. The two main songs DEFYING GRAVITY and “I Have Been Changes for Good” bring out some of the primary thematic material from the original story, which is not overall happy starting with how Elphaba’s parents who were social climbers of the first order there in Oz, tried to hide Elfie’s greenness. If the story intrigues you, read, don’t watch. Then watch if you must.

My granddaughter and I have been reading the first of Gregory Maguire’s “Wicked” trilogy which I suggested because she thought the movie was “lame.” She’s really unhappy with the musical version. Can’t say I blame her.

Anyway, with a kiddo in the house, Halloween has been on our minds for a couple weeks and I have started seeing the trailers for part 2 of the movie. I’ll see it just because the cast is so damn good and everyone has bought in to the concept 100%. Especially Erivo as Elphaba, and Ariana Grande’s voice is just so enviable (from this old operatic soprano whose cords are just toast). I used to bust out the Queen of the Night aria from “The Magic Flute,” high Es? No sweat.

Oh the puzzle. Super easy. I saw the green and thought, “Huh, it is Halloween almost and it is Thursday, could the green all be about “Wicked?” Sure ‘nuff. Had zero trouble going across and was sure of everything all the way down through 31A, ABC and decided to stop for a minute and see what was going on themewise. And there she was - ELP_ABA. Theme revealed.

Finished in a trice and then went back to enjoy the construction. Masterful. For the first time ever, I agree that the circles and the grid color were important and legit. Doesn’t mean I like all the “artistic” grid stuff, but I agree with OFL today that the theme was extremely well done and the “artistic” stuff was relevant. Even the floating circles at happy music time. See? I keep my mind open. Or, as Robert Swenson, cello/string bass prof at Illinois before, during and quite a while after “my years” would often say “Keep an open mind?! My mind is so open my brains have fallen out!”

Very appropriate for the season. Easy and fun.

jberg 11:32 AM  

Nancy, I turn into Anonymous once in a while, and it has happened to others here. I don't think it's Rex, I think it's a bug in Blogger. It means it has logged you out; if you login again you should regain your name.

Anonymous 4:08 PM  

Don’t worry, Les, Disney has nothing to do with Wicked. It’s a Universal production just like the stage musical was.

Andrew R 9:51 PM  

The clue
Is wrong, but the man on second rule has not been in existence for "many" years, unless 5 is"many," which it isn't.
If memory serves, it was instituted in baseball during the COVID season and, unfortunately, retained.

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