Guy who inspired an early 2010s hip-hop dance / THU 5-18-23 / Video game franchise featuring a clone assassin / Cuban song genre that shares its name with a Spanish dance / First film appearance of Herbie, a sentient 1963 Volkswagen Beetle

Thursday, May 18, 2023

Constructor: Kiran Pandey

Relative difficulty: Easy


THEME: ignore the comma and put some quotation marks around the last word? — all the theme clues end with ", for ___"; you have to take the word in the blank literally, so, e.g. with 17A: Slang, for many, instead of "for many" meaning "Slang used by many people," it now means "Slang for the word 'many'," i.e. ZILLIONS
Theme answers:
  • ZILLIONS (17A: Slang, for many) (i.e. not slang used by many people but [Slang for "many"])
  • ROMAN NUMERAL (24A: I, for one) (i.e. not "Me, for example" but [What "I" is when it stands for "one"])
  • ELECTRICAL FAULT (37A: Scientific definition, for short) (i.e. not an abbr. of a scientific definition, but [Scientific definition for "short"])
  • SEVEN LETTERS (49A: Length, for example) (i.e. not something length is an example of, but [Length of the word "example"]) 
  • ANCIENTS (61A: Anagram, for instance) (i.e. not something that an anagram is an example of, but [An anagram of the word “instance"])
Word of the Day: The DOUGIE (63A: Guy who inspired an early 2010s hip-hop dance) —

The Dougie (/ˈdʌɡi/ [...] DUG-ee) is an African-American hip hop dance generally performed by moving one's body in a shimmy style and passing a hand through or near the hair on one's own head.

The dance originated in Dallas, Texas, where it took its name from similar moves performed by 1980s rapper Doug E. Fresh. The Dougie gained notoriety through rapper Lil' Wil, whose song "My Dougie", released in late 2007, became a local hit. Then, a person called C-Smoove in Southern California taught the future members of Cali Swag District how to do the dance. Cali Swag District recorded the song "Teach Me How to Dougie" and filmed the music video in Inglewood, California, during the summer of 2009. Subsequently, the video along with the dance became popular on YouTube. (wikipedia)

• • •

I confess I did not grasp the concept here fully, and after trying to describe it (above), I'm still not sure I get it. I didn't even see that there was a theme until I was halfway down the grid. Everything was so easy, I got real suspicious, expecting that at any moment the gimmick would leap out and bite my leg. And then I got to [Scientific definition, for short] and none of it made any sense. But I put this down to my being very ignorant of scientific definitions generally, and I just kept going. It was only at SEVEN LETTERS (which was a bear to parse) that I finally saw that there was some kind of clue trickery involved. But that trickery seems inconsistent and ... well, largely invisible for a good chunk of the solve. I guess the core idea is that the theme clues are written to look like they're asking for one type of answer, with familiar crossword clue phrasing at the end (", for ___"), but then the real answer can only be arrived at if you repunctuate the clue, eliminating the comma (for the most part) and putting quot. marks around the final word so that you understand that the clue refers to the word itself, not what it appears to mean grammatically in the sentence. So, it's [Slang for the word "many"]. OK. This is almost a non-trick. It's more confusion than trickery, since trickery would involve my eventually going "Aha! You have done this one clever thing and now that I understand that thing, the whole puzzle becomes clear." But instead I was left going "Is this ... it? Is this the gimmick?" And 40% of the themers were easy to get without having any idea there even *was* a theme. That [I, for one] clue is really really bugging me, because I see that "I" is the ROMAN NUMERAL for "one" but that is basically what the clue already says, as written. And I see that you are trying to misdirect by making "I" look like a pronoun, but ... the theme isn't just misdirection. If I don't have to change the cluing in my head at all to make sense of the clue, how is it ... thematic? [V, for five] could also get you ROMAN NUMERAL. [X, for ten], likewise. I mean, they're not *good* clues, but they work. And [I, for one] seems good as written for ROMAN NUMERAL. Also "I" is in fact an example of a ROMAN NUMERAL!!!! The clue works, as written, on both levels (with "for one" meaning either "for the number 'one'" or "for example"). So ... I just never got exactly what the puzzle wanted me to get. The concept simply doesn't snap into place. It's all executed very awkwardly. 

[ALANA]

I did find the fill enjoyable in many places. I particularly liked the UPBEAT SW corner. "YE GODS! They're doing the DOUGIE! In the STUDY! They're going to knock over my E.A. POE statue! Hooligans! Get back in your LOVE BUG and drive away!" To be clear, EAPOE is dreadful fill, but if I make it part of a little narrative, it suddenly gets much better. I wonder how many solvers were like "who is this DOUGIE character!!?!?" Seems like that one could stump a lot of the NYTXW's solver base. The song / lyric "Teach me how to DOUGIE" is just background noise in my head—not sure how it got in there, but it's in there. But Doug E. Fresh, after whom the DOUGIE is named, is a legendary rapper and beatboxer who collaborated with Slick Rick on two early hip-hop classics, "La Di Da Di" and "The Show." Good memories of being in the car with my friend Malcolm and having those songs on the tape deck.


Toughest part of the grid for me today was in the SEVEN LETTERS region, right in the middle there. Could not get to SLATES from [Tickets] and always thought a [Fracas] was a TO-DO, not an ADO, and ... well I had GONER before I had TOAST at 51D: Dead meat, so to speak. Lots of confusion there, but the rest of the puzzle was so easy that it hardly affected my overall solving time. There's maybe too much short junk in this grid: SANDL WAH ODIST SOU, and then the NENA ETNA TSAR crosswordese trifecta there in the SE. Counselor TROI even came out of retirement to make an appearance. I don't mind TROI, but there was a lot of (over-)familiar stuff. Hope this theme resonated with you more than it did with me. See you tomorrow.

Signed, Rex Parker, King of CrossWorld 

P.S. a mini(skirt) "displays" your KNEE (55D: Mini display?); the party who leases is a "letter" so a MALL is a [Chain letter?] in that malls lease space to (store) chains (e.g. The Gap or Orange Julius or Hot Topic or whatever)

[Follow Rex Parker on Twitter and Facebook]

112 comments:

Conrad 6:16 AM  


My big error was when I had -----RICA... at 37A and more-or-less confidently figured it'd turn out to be --AMERICA(something).

Lots of names that I didn't know or couldn't quite call up: ARI Aster at 9D, ALANA Haim at 12D, Chloe ZHAO at 14A, ELLA Baker at 27D, Simu LIU at 43A, TROI at 47D and DOUGIE at 49D (I thought he was a character in a children's book).

Happily, for the first time ever I guessed right when spelling KAHLUA (8D), but I had no confidence in it until all the crosses worked.

Anonymous 6:20 AM  

Bzzt?! Uh, no. Supremely dissatisfying parsefest. A) Fill in the boxes, somewhat painstakingly. B) Shrug, wonder what the theme was. C) Not really care.

Anonymous 6:42 AM  

Getting the theme answers wasn't too hard. The cluing felt (to me) a tad tougher than the typical Thursday, but I managed just fine. Except the SW corner that just ANNIHILATED me, even with SEVENLETTERS TAE EAPOE EGO in place. SLATES from "tickets" was super tough, plus the unknowns DOUGIE and YEGODS. THE LOVE what? UP what? Is STUDY even right? For "backing" I was thinking FOR or PRO, not a noun, so AID took some time to emerge. It's very rare for me (except on a Fri/Sat) to run into a corner with the perfect combination of unknowns and vague clues to stump me for so long. Took about half my time to sort out that one area.

ALANA/SANDL is just terrible. I knew HITMAN, but I've seen comments from some people guessing HITMEN there, which is 100% understandable.

The MALL - "letter" connection feels off to me. Where in a MALL would you rent stuff instead of buying it?

Anonymous 6:44 AM  

EL[?]NA crossing HITM[?}N !! I knew neither, but each was semi-inferable. I couldn't believe that a video game had but one lonely assassin (was the person from whom he was cloned also an assassin? Then it would be HITMEN, no?), so I want with the plural HITMeN and ELeNA, and forgot about that conundrum. Took me 10 minutes to track that one down.

SouthsideJohnny 6:50 AM  

I’m pretty much the opposite of OFL today - thought the theme was promising but it was surrounded by just too much slop - I mean your fill is stuff like BZZT, TROI, ZHAO, YEGODS, LIU, EAPOE, WAH, SANDL . . . That’s just too much BS to wade through while parsing out the theme entries as well. Good try, but a bit of a slog to complete.

Anonymous 7:04 AM  

PPP slog without much reward from the fill or cluing. Liked SOMERSAULT but Herbie THE LOVE BUG as its counterpart was a downer. Disagree on the SW corner - YEGODS felt alien and EAPOE is irredeemable.

Need help with explaining
- KNEE for “Mini display?”
- MALL for “Chain letter?”

Wanderlust 7:08 AM  

YE GODS and Holy TOLEDO, I really liked this. Like Rex, it took me a long time to get the theme but I knew something was afoot when SEVEN LETTERS became apparent and seemed to have nothing to do with the clue. I counted the letters in “length” and thought, “No, that isn’t it.” Didn’t occur to me to count the letters in “example.” I think I finally noticed the “for” consistency while trying to parse what came after ELECTRICAL. I looked at SEVEN LETTERS and ANCIENTS (already filled in) and got it. That gave me one of the best Ahas! I ever had solving a puzzle. And finishing the top three was fun. I don’t understand Rex’s explanation of why the theme didn’t work for him.

There were also a lot of great clues, especially “mini display” for KNEE, “low turnover” for SOMERSAULT and “chain letter” for MALL. The NW corner was the last to fall, partly because of that clue.

The proper names, almost all women, were all up my alley, except for DOUGIE. But was fun to learn that’s where the “hand smoothing hair” move comes from.

This was just a 100% delight for me.

kitshef 7:15 AM  

Theme played no part in the solve, but in looking at it after the fact, I quite liked it.

I was very young when THE LOVE BUG came out and didn't think much about it, but what a bizarre idea for a movie that is.

ROCKET made me think of Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 3, a movie that really affected me emotionally. Joins Seeking a Friend for the End of the World and Charlotte’s Web in that.

Lewis 7:19 AM  

OMG I loved this.

When I uncovered ZILLIONS, the first theme answer I cracked, I actually would have done a spit-take had I had any liquid in my mouth. I immediately put it down as a clue-of-the-week possibility. The combo of wordplay and humor, playing on a standard clue type (X, for Y), scored a direct hit on my funny-bone. I wanted to run out of the room and show it to someone, but of course, no one in the house would have appreciated it.

It didn’t hit me at that point that this was actually the theme. I was still waiting for something Thursday Tricky to happen. After I uncovered the second theme answer, I thought, “Could this actually be the theme?” ELECTRICAL FAULT, which cracked me up as much as ZILLIONS, sealed the deal. Then I still had two more theme answers to go, with the additional fun of trying to guess them while knowing what was going on.

So, this whole outing, for me, was the embodiment, the definition of fun. A WEB of “Hah!”s and “Aha!”s. A playground. A comedy special that spectacularly landed. Pure entertainment.

Kiran, I think I was your perfect audience for this one. You slayed me. I adored this. I will remember your puzzle, which rocketed me from content to ebullient. Bravo, and uber-gratitude for your creation!

Anonymous 7:26 AM  

When you wear a mini-skirt, your KNEE is visible
“Letter” as in the mostly British meaning “person who leases space”. MALLs are full of chain stores

Phillyrad1999 7:28 AM  

BZZT to the whole theme! No one uses a T when they annoyingly simulate the buzzer sound for a wrong answer. I don’t think SEVENLETTERS is a good example of this theme and seems to not be consistent with the other themes. For me this exercise was BOMB!

Johnny Laguna 7:34 AM  

Hated it.

Anonymous 7:35 AM  

@Anonymous 6:42 Malls rent space to chain stores.

Anonymous 7:36 AM  

I think the clue on mall was a bit wicked.

andrew 7:45 AM  

I say BUZZ (oops, BZZT!) to this Total Dud.

At least it was clear from Roman Numeral Clue I, this would be a BOMB (Thursday’s typically DA BOMB). YEGODS!

GAC 7:46 AM  


Miserable puzzle for me. Too many people I never heard of, too much stupid stuff like BZZT. Looking forward to Friday.

jammon 7:46 AM  

BZZT...it just keeps getting worse.

JonB3 7:52 AM  

Who had Chain MAiL and the weird ass spelling of ziilions?

Ted 7:59 AM  

3D "Chain letter" was too precious by half, for short fill. MALL, right, sure, but MILL and MULL and even maybe MOLL could have fit there, and crossing a proper noun of a non-English name? Practically a Natick. Just... turn down the confusion factor on that 3D clue and we're fine.

Otherwise lovely. Simple enough theme, good answers.

Kent 8:00 AM  

My experience with the theme was similar to Rex’s. I had the first three themers but didn’t realize there was a theme until I hit SEVEN LETTERS. Still took me a few minutes to figure out ELECTRICAL FAULT.

99 Luftballons is one of those songs from my youth that pop into my head frequently (I was taking German in high school at the time, so heard it more that most), but I can never remember which combination of vowels go where with the two Ns in the singer’s name. Fortunately the crosses got me there, but I still don’t understand the clue for KNEE (Mini display?).

Groaned and loved the clue for MALL. I had MAiL initially, which didn’t completely make sense but went with both “chain” and “letter.”

One of the earliest chapter books I remember reading was a novelization of THE LOVE BUG, so that was a warm memory. I’m not sure I’ve ever seen the movie, oddly enough.

Peter P 8:01 AM  

I'm with @Lewis on this one. I thoroughly enjoyed the wordplay here with the themers, and even stuff like BZZT was right on my wavelength (first fill for me on an empty grid.) Finished as a breezy Thursday. It took about a minute after finishing the puzzle to understand that KNEE clue, and once I did, it may be my favorite non-theme clue in the puzzle. MALL for "chain letter" I didn't quite enjoy as much.

pabloinnh 8:05 AM  

Crashed and burned on ZHAO (total unknown) crossing BZZT. I mean, BZZT? Really? Also the realization that removing the commas from the clues made them obvious came to me far too late, leading to more of a how did I miss that? feeling than an aha! . Come on, pablo, wake up.

A couple of clues that I found misleading (chain letter, mini display), which I dislike, rather than misdirecting (usual crossword ploy) which I do like.

For a list of unknown names, please see @Conrad. Too many of these.

Nice enough Thursday, KP, but you Kept Pushing buttons that didn't quite work for me. Mostly they went BZZT, I guess. Thanks for some fun anyway.

Eric B. Is President 8:23 AM  

I was in undergrad when “Teach Me How To Dougie” came out. Imagine, if you will, drunk white university students attempting to Dougie at a bar or frat party. Absolute scenes.

Also I’m pretty sure every NFL player who scored a touchdown in a certain 3 week period in 2011 did the Dougie. Even the quarterbacks.

Taylor Slow 8:24 AM  

@Anonymous 6:20 AM: "Supremely dissatisfying parsefest"
@Anonymous 7:04 AM: "PPP slog without much reward"

Me: Yes to both of you, and what a disappointment for someone who looks forward all week to the Thursday puzzle and some sparkling and clever solving fun. No rebuses (rebii?), no word tricks, no brain-teasers, just a lot of video game and Star Trek and hip-hop trivia. And groaning clues like SEVEN LETTERS referring to the "example" in "for example." Are you serious? I could not feel 5D.

Sam Buttrey left Jeopardy! Masters yesterday, which also made me sad--I love Sam. And I've been remembering with great fondness his brilliant and delightful Thursday puzzle of just a few weeks ago (April 5). What a stark contrast to whatever this was!

Adam12 8:24 AM  

Not once, ever in my life, have I heard the term YEGODS. And I’m a ZILLION years old. BZZT is the most awful fill I may have ever seen. Upsets me that I took a DNF, the fill is atrocious, the theme seen only in retrospect and Rex deems it “easy”,

Mr. Grumpypants 8:29 AM  

That was just horrible and unforgivable. What a crap fest of obscure names, dumb clues, and an inane theme. Give me my Thursday back!

Gary Jugert 8:44 AM  

The theme dude finally showed up for work. He's reeking of KAHLUA and CK ONE, but it's the best theme of the week. Nice idea to poke fun at those weird crossword comma-ed add-ons.

Most of the rest was meh.

Nice: ZILLIONS. THE LOVE BUG. BOLERO.

Clunk-o-rama:

BZZT: Seriously. Hardest spelling in the puzzle as it could be any string of letters apparently.
TAILS: Down?
WAH: Played in an -- PAH band.
ODIST: They live next to a neighborist.
YEGODS: What???! How is that even publishable?
SANDL: Shoe worn by the Society of A Omitters.

Why constructors need to have a license before they're allowed to use any people names in their tragic grimy squares ... just look at this random letter festival: ZHAO, LIU, TAE, DOUGIE, NENA, EAPOE, ARI, TROI, ELLA, ALANA.

Tee-Hee: AREOLA. (On my favorite word list between HAVOC and SKOSH.)

Uniclues:

1 Spike the prom punchbowl in Manhattan.
2 Salary schedule entry at Dewey, Wackum & Howe, attorneys at law.
3 A studio apartment in a bad neighborhood.
4 Toga party invitees.
5 Any strip joint.
6 Every "rock legend reunion tour."
7 I like 20-year-old blondes, or I want ice cream.
8 Common affliction of the over roller.

1 BOMB KANSAS GYM (~)
2 HITMAN: ZILLIONS (~)
3 ODIST ESTATE
4 UPBEAT ANCIENTS
5 THE LOVE BUG MALL
6 GLOOMIER SLATES
7 YEN ADMITTED
8 SOMERSAULT KNEE

Andy S 8:48 AM  

Had rOAST for dead meat.

Anonymous 8:52 AM  

For anybody who wants to see a fine movie that does not involve superheroes or marvel characters, Remains of the Day is a master acting class courtesy of Anthony Hopkins and Emma Thompson...

KM 8:57 AM  

Absolutely stumped in the NW. BZZT crossing ZHAO and ZILLIONS which
was part of a theme I only partially grasped until reading an explanation. Wow. I can't believe anybody could think this one was easy, this was the toughest Thursday I can remember and I think I need another cup of coffee.

burtonkd 8:59 AM  

I thought the Thursday gimmick would be that there was no gimmick. I understood all the theme answers other than ELECTRICALFAULT, but didn't see how they connected to each other until RP. (BTW, that's the main disappointment with the NYer puzzles - noone to explain or kvetch with.)

I would quibble with the "easy" rating, at least in terms of time spent; never stuck, but no woosh. NW completely blank until the end. Wasn't sure if it was supposed to be a two word city, or a 4 letter city and its 6 letter sister. BZZT was fun when it appeared along with ZILLIONS. Loved "chain letter?" for MALL, but certainly didn't get that without crosses. Chloe Zhao is a name made for crosswords.

I would have liked "half a sad trombone" for WAH.

I love Simu LIU, (from Kim's Convenience), and we just saw the other half of his name, but that is a toughie to remember.

We need a word for an answer that arrives without understanding the clue, then gives that AHA moment. KNEE really resisted being filled in; after I finally gave in, THEN understood the clue.

My diamonds were fAcEtted before LASERCUT

bocamp 9:19 AM  

Thx, Kiran; what a blast! 😊

Very tough!

Beyond Sat. hard for me.

Still working on sussing out the theme.[ok, got it]

Buzz before BZZT. Holy TOLEDO to the rescue.

Last fill was ZHAO; finally dawned what 'letter' has to do with MALL. Very clever clueing overall.

Definitely a worthwhile expenditure of brain cells! :)

An excellent adventure! :)
___
Peace 🕊 🇺🇦 ~ Compassion ~ Tolerance ~ Kindness & Freudenfreude to all 🙏

Alice Pollard 9:20 AM  

BZZT, LIU, SOU, ZHAO - ugh. not sure how this was “easy” rex. Even LASERCUT took me awhile after I had most of the letters. I did like the theme. I kind of reversed each clue . ie Example length; One is I; etc. I liked the KNEE clue. Nipple ring was cute too.

Liveprof 9:29 AM  

Since I'm a dirty old man, it was exciting to see that KNEE in the "mini display." Right next to ASCEND, said Tom droolingly. (55D; 48D)

Re: Anonymous (8:52) "Remains of the Day" was very good in novel form too.

RooMonster 9:30 AM  

Hey All !
Falling twixt y'all, didn't hate it, didn't love it. Took me forever to figure out what was happening, but finally grokked the Theme-in-clues thing. Seems a bunch of us clicked on it at SEVEN LETTERS, here also. I was like, "wait, Length is six LETTERS! Wait a tic, example is SEVEN ... Oooph, I see, Length for example!" Went back and parsed the other "for" clues, allowing me to get the Center Themer, as FAULT was hiding rather well.

Still, a kinda meh reaction, this being on Thursday. Seems like it would've been a hit for a WedsPuz. Two cents, and whatnot.

FWE at pAH/pEB, even though pEB isn't a thing. Also, Eye for END/ALAyA/SANeL. Again the AND of S AND L very well hidden. Not ROCKET ASCENDing in my puzzliness. EGADS, er YE GODS.

If you're unflappable, it means you can't be FLAPped.

Two F's
RooMonster
DarrinV

Anonymous 9:32 AM  

Funny! I thought BZZT immediately and then didn’t know any of the crosses and decided that it must be buzz. But my instinct turned out to be correct.

Nancy 9:32 AM  

It took me forever to figure out the gimmick -- and I absolutely loved the gimmick! I didn't get it until ROMAN NUMERAL came in -- and only then did I understand the "why" of such answers as SEVEN LETTERS and ANCIENTS -- each of which I had resisted writing in until I couldn't resist anymore.

But if you've only heard of a BUZZ and never a BZZT (??!!) and in addition you don't know ZHAO, you won't be able to finish this puzzle. Even if, like me, you successfully guessed both TOLEDO OHIO and ZILLIONS. (FWIW, I say ZILLIONS all the time, so that was easy for me.)

Oh and yes, I had ROCK iT instead of ROCKET for "go through the roof", so I had to look up NE?A, the singer. When she turned out to be NENA, giving me iTNA for the Zeus place, I gave myself a head slap and changed the "I" to an "E".

A theme I adored. It's both well conceived and very well-executed.
As for some of the fill -- YE GODS.

Smith 9:37 AM  

@burtonkd def with you on the NYer puzzles... maybe we should start a blog...

Thought this puzzle was a tad harder than @Rex did, only because of the nw corner, last to fill in. BZZT? Huh? Had the B from BOMB, the erroneous m from mILLIONS, and the T from TOLEDO. B_mT and I got nothing, not being sure of Chloé's last name CHAO?

Finally got the Z for ZILLIONS after realizing that mILLIONS isn't slang and believe it or not, like @Pablo, was left with that naticky square. Sigh.

And yet it didn't seem all that Thursday tricky. Caught on at ROMANNUMERAL which was pretty obvious. Liked ANCIENTS. Otherwise, meh.

beverly c 9:38 AM  

I'm with team Lewis. It wasn’t until the end when I wrote in and understood what what happening with ZILLIONS. I laughed out loud. (Also for MALL. What a clue!) Then I was able to go back and see how ELECTRICALFAULT made sense, what word was being anagrammed, etc.

This wasn’t all that easy for me. The NW with ZILLIONS was the last area I filled. Mainly because I didn’t think of putting in the state OHIO when the clue asked for city. So I ended up googling ZHAO. BOLERO had gone in and back out. TOLEDO had looked likely, but I had nothing but the DO

BZZT is how I'd spell it, except maybe adding another Z or two.

So many entertaining clues. This was a treat. Thanks to the constructor!

Tina 9:40 AM  

Can someone explain 61a for me? Did not understand the connection between anagram and ancients

egsforbreakfast 9:49 AM  

I’m all the way with @Lewis on this one. If you didn’t like it, and most of you apparently didn’t, I wouldn’t recommend Lynne Truss’s book “Eats, Shoots and Leaves.”

I will concede that starting with a made up word at 1D (BZZT) is inauspicious, but it was good from there. Rex’s theme criticisms make so little sense that I don’t even want to address them. Maybe he got too much sleep.

Thanks for a beauty, Kieran Pandey.

Alice Pollard 10:01 AM  

Tina - “ancients” is an anagram for “instance”. (Rearrange the letters)

Nancy 10:02 AM  

Uniclues:

1) By age 60, you'll need to have it replaced

2) U.S. elections in the 2020s, alas

3) Sisyphus before that damned rock, Pandora before that damned box, and Socrates before that damned hemlock

4) Comment from a French Luddite




1) SOMERSAULT KNEE

2) GLOOMIER SLATES

3) UPBEAT ANCIENTS

4) INTRANET NON

Bob Mills 10:04 AM  

A ridiculous theme, and a collection of obscure people we're supposed to know makes for a totally unrewarding couple of hours. The least enjoyable puzzle I've done in a long while.

Anonymous 10:07 AM  

@burton and @smith. Check out crosswordfiend.com for discussion of other puzzles including the New Yorker

Anonymous 10:08 AM  

ANCIENTS is an anagram of the word “instance”

Michelle Turner 10:13 AM  

Ancients is an anagram of instance.

Eddy 10:23 AM  

Tina, 9:40…Anagram for “instance” (ANCIENTS).

SimonSays 10:24 AM  

My least favorite day of the week, puzzlewise, and this one was worse than usual. A head-scratcher of a theme with crap trivia and shallow stabs at humor. This construction needs some polish, seriously, too bad WS and staff couldn’t help.

Anonymous 10:34 AM  

Nipple ring? Don't think there s/b a ? mark there..

Carola 10:40 AM  

Ultra-challenging for me, thanks to the diabolical clues in just the wrong spots, the many unknown names, and my failure to grasp the theme, until "Length" and SEVEN LETTERS bopped me on the head and I saw the clue pattern. That explained why ANCIENTS was right, and allowed me to finish filling in ELECTRICAL FAULT, ROMAN NUMERAL, and ZILLIONS. I was still left with thorny spots in the NW and NE, but guesses and alphabet runs got me through. So, a real struggle, but I really enjoyed it. I loved the "hiding in plain sight" theme: I'm not sure that I always like getting faked out by a constructor, but I certainly did today.

Do-over: rOAST before TOAST, and I was happy I was wrong (the "dead meat" clue). Help from previous puzzles: LIU. No idea: ZHAO, ALANA, ARI, HITMAN, DOUGIE, ELLA.

Dan 10:41 AM  

I liked it!

mathgent 10:43 AM  

I completed the puzzle correctly last night without understanding the gimmick. "Length" has six letters, not seven. But I wanted to go to sleep, so I went to Jeff Chen and he explained it well.

Looking back on the puzzle this morning, I think that the gimmick only really works for two of the five, SEVENLETTERS and ZILLIONS. ELECTRICALFAULT isn't a definition of "short" no matter how thin you stretch Joaquin's Dictum. It's a term.

But there is a lot to like in the puzzle. Good sparkle, smart cluing. The clue for KANSAS. Happy to have done it.

Anonymous 10:45 AM  

Absolutely terrible. EAPOE SANDL, MALL, ANCIENTS, KNEE, SEVEN LETTERS...All just horrible. And it's DOUG E. , Not DOUGIE

jberg 10:50 AM  

Figuring out the theme answers was a lot of fun, as were some of the tricky clues, like chain letters. But they made it hard to get some other answers, e.g. ROCKET, where I spent too much time trying to thing of something that did go through a roof, like a chimney, or an aberrant dentist's drill. Well, that makes it a puzzle.

TOLEDO OHIO today has about seven different sister cities, one of which is the eponymous Spanish one. So I'm guessing that the Toledo-Toledo pairing was the original one, inspired by the shared name, and explaining why OHIO had to be in the answer. But I'm only guessing. I also learned that Toledo OH has an annual international sister city festival, which is apparently quite an event.

I have heard the expression "YE GODS and little fishes,' but seldom just the first two words alone. The singular form is "egad" in case you were wondering.

I had to read Rex to understand SANDL. He doesn't explain it, but his treating it as old crosswordese was all I needed.

I think BZZT is properly clued as the sound of a bug zapper; but since there's no zOLEDO I know of, it wasn't hard to figure out.

jae 10:50 AM  

Medium. I did a lot of this from the bottom up and caught theme with the “length” clue, which helped me finish the top half. Tricky enough for a Thursday with some fine long downs. Liked it.

Me too for goner before TOAST.

Whatsername 10:52 AM  
This comment has been removed by the author.
Whatsername 11:12 AM  

Not necessarily UPBEAT but definitely an uphill battle for me. That’s possibly because I haven’t picked up a crossword in several day but some pretty obscure names and oddball fill which others have mentioned added to the struggle. The theme was clever though and I did enjoy that part once I got there.

I resisted BZZT for a long time because the first thing that came to my mind was Bruce Willis in Die Hard and I didn’t quite know how to spell “eeehhh” in four LETTERS. Oh well, yippie kai yay anyway.

Robbie 11:21 AM  

Can anyone explain FLAPS to me?

D’Qwellner 11:24 AM  

Theme easily figured out. Plenty of cluing tricky but reasonable. But the SW was Natick city. STUDY??? Guy who? And the heavens to Betsy thing? YEGODS says nobody ever. Blech!

Joseph Michael 11:36 AM  

Easy?!? YE GODS, Rex, give me a break. This was a knock-down, drag-out fight from beginning to end and especially in the NW and SW corners.

There were too many names and weird “words,” but I loved the theme and thought the cluing was first rate. So much word play to tease me out of a sleepy Thursday morning. Especially liked the clues for MALL, KANSAS, and KNEE. I look forward to another Kiran Pandey puzzle.

Anonymous 11:38 AM  

Actually was wondering if this was one of those one off themeless puzzles for most of the fill, and I had to look up the theme after I finished. I flew through the top half, but that Seven Letters really stymied me. Last clue I got was web for nexus. Just a painful and not very fun solve for me, when I’m usually a Thursday fan.

Rug Crazy 11:43 AM  

Way too much obscure BS and BZZT? Worst puzzle in a long time. Wasn't even satisfying
to finish!

GILL I. 11:44 AM  

Good gravy....There was a theme? Where? How in the world do you go about your business, filling in the blanks and wondering what plum you might pull out of a jar. No plums today.
I still don't get it. Maybe it got up and left me.
The top and middle parts I just penned in. BZZT gave me a little bit of agita and so did BOLERO. I'm practically Cuban and I dance a lot but I had no idea that BOLERO was a Cuban song genre. Give me some Salsa or a Merengue a little Samba and even a Bachata. Ay dios mio.
Here I am filling in things like ROMAN NUMERAL and ELECtrICAL FAULT and having no clue why...
Coming to a halt at the end. EAPOE gave me more agita and YE GODS...who is DOUGIE and and TROI and and that ESTATE clue...
ANCIENTS says it all for me today. I failed...miserably. WAH WAH indeed.

jb129 12:12 PM  

Loved "Mini display?" (knee) but not much else.

MetroGnome 12:18 PM  

ZHAO? ARI/ALANA/HITMAN? LIU? EAPOE/DOUGIE? NENA?
"Easy"? Really?!

jb129 12:18 PM  

I'm sorry about Sam Buttrey too :(

Newboy 12:23 PM  

Rex calls “heads.” Newboy says “TAILS!” Kiran’s puzzle truly puzzled our Thursday and was far from easy even after the trick revealed itself with ROMAN NUMERAL. ALANA, DOUGIE & ELLA are so far from the wheelhouse that they never left steerage space and only emerged as crosses cleared the TUNA aroma of something being fishy in the clueing—YE GODS, at last a breath of fresh air. NENA and TROI at least had vibrations from days past when having sons in residence kept us ANCIENTS somewhat grounded in contemporary culture. Loved it here, so time to ASCEND and enjoy other commentariat reaction.

Masked and Anonymous 12:40 PM  

Did M&A grok the theme mcguffin before the finish line? [bzzt]
The clue for ROMANNUMERAL had made sense, but the other themer clues? [bzzt]

The SEVENLETTERS clue had seemed so silly, that M&A immediately focused his attention and investigative semi-talents there, upon finishin the solvequest. Had a heckuva ahar moment, eventually. Different. Like. Wish I coulda seen it, while still engaged somewheres in the middle of the puzfight.

distractin amount of no-knows: ZHAO. LIU. DOUGIE. ARI. ELLA. ALANA. And how to spell KAHLUA. Lost precious nanoseconds, when combined with the ongoin themer no-knows.

fave stuff: Ahar theme moment, after the fact. SOMERSAULT & clue. sneaky KNEE clue. near-sadistic MALL clue. This Pandey dude shows no mercy, when makin a ThursPuz. Texas governor A-Butt will pass a law limitin Pandey to publishin only early-week puzs, soon.

staff weeject pick: WAH. I mean, hey -- wah not? btw-er: "wah" is an Indian word used to express admiration. The dictionary is just sayin.

Thanx for the wah-worthy and sneakier than snot puztheme, Mr. Pandey dude. It was a fine-TUNAed effort to deceive. [meow] [bzzt] And once again, already, time to SPLIT...

Masked & Anonym007Us


**gruntz**

Anonymous 12:47 PM  

@GILL 11:44

Yep!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPKVjjIL8LI

johnk 1:09 PM  

A FLAP is a state of agitation; a panic.
"They're in a flap over the theme of this puzzle. "

sharonak 1:10 PM  

@Adam12 I must be 2 zillion because I've heard ye gods man times. However, I wanted something milder for "Heavens to Betsy" so had "My gosh" in there for awhile - until crosses knocked that out .





@ whoever asked if "study" were right
Absolutely YES. But I couldn't remember it. It was head slap time when the last cross filled it in.

Teedmn 1:20 PM  

I thought this puzzle was a lot of fun. I figured out the theme mid-solve, using it to figure out ELECTRICAL FAULT (with many crosses helping out) and ANCIENTS. But 49A held me up for a long time because of my rOAST at 51D which I see I share with @Carola and @Andy S. I finally checked all my crosses and came up with TOAST which made SEVEN LETTERS obvious. Still, I had to get up and walk away for a minute before STUDY let me finish the far SW.

I wanted INTercom for 22D, how old-fashioned of me. I remember having to page people back in the 80s. I suppose people get IM'd these days.

Thanks, Kiran Pandey, nice Thursday trick!

johnk 1:20 PM  

I usually dislike Thursdays, which typically these days are riddled with silly circles and the like -- making them more games than puzzles. Today, though, was Tuesday or Wednesday material. I was unfamiliar -- or at least hesitant, with ZHAO, ARI, ALANA, ELLA, DOUGIE and others, but the crosses solved that.

sharonak 1:21 PM  

Nancy'
Enjoyed your clues/answrs
Especially 4
"Intranet non" brought on a big smile. It just sounded so French.

Anonymous 1:23 PM  

For some reason this puzzle completely baffled me. I could not do it and because I'm overseas, having to use a hotspot, and feeling some pressure to fulfill various obligations, I gave up. Quite embarrassing really.

Joe Dipinto 1:34 PM  

Any musical theater buff knows that "Ye gods!" is exclaimed frequently in "The Music Man" by Zaneeta Shinn, the mayor's daughter. It was the cool slang of 1912.

okanaganer 1:46 PM  

I liked this theme a lot more than Rex and almost as much as Lewis. When I figured out the trick it was satisfying rather than annoying. Not even ruined by all the unknown names.

One typeover: AWAKEN before ASCEND. Which made me put ELLA for the 99 Luftballons singer, which I knew wasn't right.

[Spelling Bee: yd 0, last word this 4er which I was so sure I'd already used. (A very unusual distribution of word lengths yd!) QB streak 9 days.]

Anoa Bob 1:48 PM  

I'm a bit GLOOMIER and not as UPBEAT about this theme as some of yous. I wouldn't give it a BZZT but neither would I do an exuberant SOMERSAULT and yell "It was da BOMB!". It all hinges on misleading commas. "Slang for many" (sans comma) works for ZILLIONS for me even without the quotation marks. Et alia.

I agree with OFL that 24A "I, for one" works for ROMAN NUMERAL even with the comma in place, so I also think that was a bit of an outlier.

Mathgent @10:43, I worked with electrical and electronic circuitry for several years (long ago) and a short is an ELECTRICAL FAULT. If I were to find FAULT with the clue, I would use "Technical definition" rather than "Scientific definition".

Went through a KAHLÚA and vodka Black Russian phase (long ago) then graduated to White Russians by adding half and half or cream. Gave up the hard stuff (also long ago) and joined the zythophile crowd.

Trina 2:19 PM  

Way too much PPP - obscure and not readily inferable from crosses. Hated it.

Anonymous 2:23 PM  

I still don’t understand sandl. Can you explain? Thx

Lewis 2:30 PM  

@simon says -- Your post had the word "puzzlewise" in it, and to my delight, I noticed that it has a hidden name in it...

lodsf 2:37 PM  

Tickets = SLATES???? Rex said he had a difficult time “getting there” but doesn’t say how he did.
Basically liked the puzzle except for the fairly long list of obscure PPP (ZHAO, ARI as clued, ALANA, etc.)

Anonymous 2:49 PM  

Could someone explain the answer for place to get a C.D.?

Anonymous 3:08 PM  

Is “letter“ supposed to be synonymous with “lessor“ because it’s not.

Anonymous 3:41 PM  

SAVINGS & LOAN (S&L)

JC66 3:47 PM  

@lodsf

Who will be on the Republican presidential TICKET/SLATE in 2024?

lodsf 3:59 PM  

Letter, in this context, is one who “lets”, or in British parlance, one who rents or leases (would be lessee). The Lessor is the other side, the one who is renting space out; presumably the Mall in this case.

Anonymous 4:06 PM  

Rather strange that to discover the theme , the solver has to discard the comma and put quotation marks around the last word
Clues might require some difficult interpretation but rewriting ? Nothing in the clues (as published ) in any way suggests such action.

After all, fairly easy going.




Canon Chasuble 4:14 PM  

As the English Poet Laureate Nahum Tate once wrote, “yours be the blame, YE GODS, For II Obey your will, but with more ease would die.”

Sam Ross 4:21 PM  

Found this harder than most Thursdays. Was looking for a real theme where there wasn’t one. Finished without errors, though.

Mainly, I came here for an explanation of the clue on MALL. I get it now, but I don’t like it.

Anonymous 4:30 PM  

I understand that having had a 40 year career in real estate. That definition of “letter” is not found in the Oxford dictionary or in business.
Green paint.
I did finish, but with a scowl.

Anonymous 4:40 PM  

Horrible…now we have to solve the clues to understand the clues.

Anonymous 4:57 PM  

Savings and Loans Bank to get a certificate of deposit

Anonymous 5:00 PM  

My review: BZZT

Mary 5:44 PM  

Loved this puzzle. Easy but satisfying.

Anonymous 5:53 PM  

BZZT makes no sense. The rest of puzzle worked. That seemed cheap, especially at the start.

Anonymous 7:09 PM  

Ye gods man, obviously not contemporary English but quite common in Shakespeare and certainly in 18th Century English.
I have certainly seen it many times and perhaps you may have but forgot ? It is not that obscure, I don’t think. Egads is a less offensive version of it BTW.

Anonymous 8:06 PM  

I finished the puzzle without getting the theme, and even after reading Rex’s explanation I STILL don’t get the theme. Oh well

Sandy McCroskey 12:11 AM  

The theme clues are of the type one often finds in cryptic crosswords (the best kind!), where punctuation is often deliberately misleading. So I had no problem with that. Still, seemed more like a themed early-week puzzle (I skip those) than a Thursday with a special gimmick.

Louis 12:28 AM  

I originally thought “Chain letter” was MAIL. 😀

Joe 6:16 AM  

The thing that tripped me up was putting ‘PAH’ instead of the correct ‘WAH’. This was a clever puzzle, with a lot of interesting clues.

Joe 6:40 AM  

Chloe ZHAO, ELLA Baker, ZENA, DOUGIE, Simu LIU, ARI Aster, ALANA Haim, TROI. I forgot to mention: I have never heard of any of them. But now I am going to try to expand my horizons. I will start by researching TROI. This is going to be fun.

Anonymous 6:45 AM  

I had an entirely different solving experience. Couldn’t get any bearings. Too many proper names. No idea what the theme was. Big DNF.

Anonymous 11:08 PM  

Truly the most terrible puzzle I have ever done . Bzzt??? Really??? What is that? I usually like solving for new words as it expands my vocabulary but too many proper names here to make it fun. Like many I solved ( or should I say slogged) but still don’t “get” the theme The theme just doesn’t thrill. No aha moment here by the constructor. Just utter confusion . Bzzt indeed

Anonymous 9:38 AM  

Sorry, but it’s “lessee.” There’s no such term as “letter” in this context.

Burma Shave 1:42 AM  

THE END?

DOUGIE seems to be UPBEAT,
AND did a SOMERSAULT,
the LOVEBUG bit him in THE seat,
“YEGODS DEAR, not my FAULT!”

--- STU LIU

spacecraft 10:31 AM  

I get so incensed when OFNP calls a puzzle "easy" that I struggled with at every turn. And I was MIFFed before coming here because of that ampersandwich at 13 down. I'll say this again: it makes NO SENSE WHATSOEVER to abbreviate two words while SPELLING OUT the word "and" between them. This can happen OMLY in a crossword, and shouldn't happen even there. I say throw them all out!

The other real groaner was 49 across. This kind of stuff is no fun to do. Then we have all the unknown PPPs. I made an outright guess for ZH_O/M_LL. The clue for the latter is way off the wall.

It wasn't easy--at ALL--and it wasn't fun. The only bright spot was including Marina Sirtis' TROI for DOD. Bogey.

Wordle par.

Brianlas 11:13 AM  

Same here. Fun and challenging!

Diana, LIW 1:33 PM  

Prize, for this puzzle. a ZILLION triumph points!

When I got "it," OMG. Light bulb. WHA WHA left the room and RAH RAH took its place. Answer after answer made sense but no sense. Then...TA DA!

Hooray!

Diana, Lady-in-Waiting for Crosswords

Anonymous 5:26 PM  

I love a puzzle that has so many solvers getting their knickers in a bunch!
It feels so good LETTING It all sink in.

Anonymous 7:09 PM  

Second really crappy "theme" this week. A real slog, no fun at alk

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