Newspaper VIP Baquet / SUN 6-5-16 / Fictional braggart / Default avatar for new Twitter user / Silmarillion creature / Flirtatious wife in Of Mice Men / Finnigan friend of Harry Potter / Charm City baseball player

Sunday, June 5, 2016

Constructor: Tom McCoy

Relative difficulty: Medium

THEME: Word Search — clues all start "Where you can find...?" (see, you're "searching" for a "word"), and then every answer is both a familiar term / phrase *and* directions telling you where you might find the other word (in different familiar terms / phrases). Hence:

Theme answers:
  • 23A: Where you can find ... "jacket" or "yourself"? (FOLLOWING SUIT) (because "suit jacket" and "suit yourself")
  • 31A: ... "go" or "so"? (BEFORE LONG)
  • 37A: ... "anybody" or "cooking"? (CLOSE TO HOME)
  • 65A: ... "got" or "tell"? (BETWEEN YOU AND ME)
  • 93A: ... "two"or "face"? (AHEAD OF TIME)
  • 95A: ... "building" or"hours"? (POST OFFICE)
  • 113A: ... "that's" or "special"? (NEXT TO NOTHING) 
Word of the Day: ASA Gray (84D: Botanist Gray) —
Asa Gray (November 18, 1810 – January 30, 1888) is considered the most important American botanist of the 19th century. His Darwiniana was also considered an important explanation of how religion and science were not necessarily mutually exclusive. (wikipedia)
• • •

A good deal thornier than recent Sunday offerings, which is to say, about what an average Sunday puzzle should be, difficulty-wise. I solved this at the tail end of a tournament day, so my puzzle brain was a little fried, so the themers kept requiring many many crosses for me to get them, but the grid is clean and crosses fair, and the themers all work perfectly. Even though it feels like a *type* of puzzle I've seen somewhere before, the execution is so tight and clever that it felt, original, fresh, nice. It *did* do that thing I don't like where it called attention to terrible short stuff by doing cutesy clue stuff with them (see clues on E'EN and NE'ER —[Contraction missing a V]— ... there's also an ERE, if you dare). But that has virtually no impact on the overall solving experience.

It's pretty funny that this puzzle is titled "Word Search" because if you follow mentions of the word "crossword" on Twitter (as I do), you know that So Many people out there refer to things that are not "crosswords" as "crosswords," most commonly "criss-cross" puzzles (you may have seen these in some stupid assignment your child's third- or seventh- or twelfth- or college freshman teacher thought was "fun") and most annoyingly "word searches." All the time. Total public confusion about what the hell a "crossword puzzle" even is. The "criss-cross" confusion I kind of get. I mean, these *are* "words" that are "crossing" ...

But that's not a crossword. So calling this "Word Search" had me all worried I'd have to actually search for words in this puzzle like some kind of dope, but no. No. Thank you, Tom, for not making me circle stuff in my finished grid.

["Can't read my, can't read my..."]
[SRO = Standing Rhino, Ogling]

I'm still IN D.C. because of yesterday's Indie 500, and we're going to have to leave very soon because our entire route home is thunderstorm alley, and it's going to get quite terrible later in the day. I'll report on the tournament in a future post (Tuesday). For now, I can tell you that I won ... this:

So, you know, that's something. I also drank the crosswordesiest wine of all time—a Chateau STE Michelle Riesling called ... well, look for yourself:

It was, not surprisingly, Delicious.

See you later.

Signed, Rex Parker, King of CrossWorld

[Follow Rex Parker on Twitter and Facebook]


Lewis 8:45 AM  

Solid solid puzzle. The theme answers are smooth as silk, with wordplay galore, the grid quite clean, and lots of answers that appeal to me: GOADS, THATS_THAT, AND_SO_FORTH, HECKLE, and LOOMS. I loved that clue for SPACE ("Results of hitting the bar?").

There were no trouble zones -- the puzzle fell quickly for me, but there was enough resistance to make my brain feel happy and pop with alertness afterward. It felt like it feels walking with ankle weights, then when it's over and the weights come off, you walk with a spring to your step.

Lobster11 8:59 AM  

I really enjoyed this one. I thought the theme was great. Bonus points for the themers all being examples of common phrases in addition to providing instructions for "finding" the words. Most important, I found myself throughout the solve flipping back and forth between using crosses to figure out the themers and using the themers to figure out crosses -- just the way I like it.

I laughed out loud when I saw that OFL had the same initial reaction to the puzzle title; i.e., a sense of dread that the puzzle was going to play like a themeless and then I'd have to do a "word search" on the completed grid. Exactly the kind of after-the-fact theme that I dislike. WHEW!

Unknown 8:59 AM  

A clever theme but required too much junk fill. The variety "cryptic" was populated with groaners as well. Did I miss something? Is it National Bad Clueing Day?

Z 9:03 AM  

A-ha has more than one song?

Had same worry as Rex when I saw the title, so very pleased with the theme. That the themes are all stand alone phrases repurposed (really spell check? a hyphen? Bah!) to tell us where to find the clue words is very nice.

One problem, more than a nit really, is that this is three puzzles loosely hanging together by the barest of threads. CLIMB, I TOO, DEAN, and EMERY connect the middle diagonal puzzle to the NW and SE. I always prefer a little more crossing in my crosswords.

A fine Sunday that kept me thinking throughout. Nicely done.

Carola 9:12 AM  

I really enjoyed this creative puzzle. Very nicely done theme - and it was fun to try to anticipate the theme phrases, not a one of them forced. I also liked the overall CHERI, I mean, cheery feel - it's true that there's a TROLL to HECKLE and give some GRIEF, but overall, the accent is on the positive, with WHOOPEE, WHEE, a GAG followed by HAR HAR, ELATE, PAEANS, an ODE that EXALTS, and an ADORABLE, CUTESY NICETY - not to mention the student-saving EASY A and BELL.
I liked how "BETWEEN' got the center spot separating the top from the bottom of the grid.

Nancy 9:13 AM  

I found this puzzle enormously enjoyable and entertaining -- with a theme that was original and consistently interesting. I always really like it when getting one theme answer is not all that helpful in getting any of the others -- when each has to be puzzled out separately. Adding to my pleasure was the fact that's there isn't any junk to be seen anywhere. I had GAB before GAG at 77A and left it there for too long. I had BUCK UP before BEAR UP at 118A, but it changed it immediately. I forgot that the HARE was a braggart (40D); I just knew he lost the race. I do hope that our country's most notable braggart is about to follow in his FOOTSTEPs.

My one nit is 55D. CUTE is "Aww" inspiring. CUTESY is "Yuck" inspiring. As in Dorothy Parker's deathless review of an especially CUTESY children's book: "Tonstant Weader fwowed up." (I'll come back with more details; that's all I remember.)

Anonymous 9:20 AM  

I'm not a speed solver and don't time myself but this thing filled itself in in what seemed like the blink of an eye. Answers felt like they were going in before I even read the clues. Not exactly unpleasant -- and the theme answers were mostly cute -- but the level of easiness (at least to me) was almost unsettling.

'mericans back in Paris 9:33 AM  

WHOOPEE! This puzzle was the Real McCoy for us. What @Rex said: clean fill, fair crosses, well-executed theme. ADORABLE but not too CUTESY. NEXT TO NOTHING to complain about.

We had fun filling in the puzzle (as always, on paper) and NE'ER once were tempted to consult Mr. Google. However, we did have to ERASE: had ANDtherest and startOFTIME before getting those two right.

Looking at the grid, I CAN SEE the "POST" in POST OFFICE due north, by four squares, of the "POST" in POSTERN. Is that a violation of some written rule? 'T AIN'T necessarily so.

BETWEEN YOU AND ME, I don't get the significance of the EROICA ("heroic" in Italian) wine for OFL.

Speaking of three-letter words, most of them can be strung together with the others:


Ellen S 10:06 AM  

Jeff Chen liked this puzzle so much, I was afraid Rex was going to hate it, but they both had pretty much the same take on it. I think we should chip in and make sure OFL stays well supplied with that Riesling.

I liked it too, but my opinion don't count as much, as I'm not a professional crossword critic.

Unknown 10:09 AM  

I took a break from doing the crossword (and thus this blog), but decided to do today’s. I thought the theme was clever and helpful once discerned. I’ll have to see if @Rex agrees (Just read him and he does!). Speaking of @Rex, I got a very nice thank you card from him for my modest contribution.

This puzzle was a “Near Miss.” I couldn’t mind my ‘Manners” having to cheat because a few words were not in my ‘Universe.’

‘As for’ the PPPs, I was “Beside myself” as these ‘included’ some that made for tough going.

“After all” was said and ‘done,’ and even though ‘knowing’ I had to cheat, I can ‘state’ it was ‘over’ too soon.

POSTERN (filled with crosses) was a new word, in spite of a fair knowledge of architecture.

There were ALSO these ADORABLE (maybe not!) colloquialisms: AW NUTS, WEE, WHOOPEE*, PHEW, TOODLEOO, CUTSEY, YOO-HOO.

* Not to be confused with my original spelling - ‘WHOOPiE’ - pertaining to the pie that is the official State TREAT of Maine. It was beat out by wild blueberry pie as Maine’s official Dessert (rightly so, IMO). The wild [lowbush] blueberry is the official Fruit of Maine, considered more flavorful than the more aesthetically appealing highbush varieties. They’re bigger, not better. Both are typically sold in punnets (another new word learned today).

A couple of years ago I played in a production of Willie Wonka (children’s version) and the OOMPA-Loompas, played by a bunch of CUTESY, early grade-schoolers always brought a smile. They were simply too ADORABLE when the director would collectively call, “Oompa-Loompas on stage,” during rehearsals and they would scurry out en masse in their colorful costumes. Love this name which still elicits a big smile from that memory.


Maruchka 10:10 AM  

WHOOPEE! A nice change up from yesterday's. And an EASY A minus for two minor do-overs.

Appreciated the clues and solves relativity. YOOHOO, Mr. McCoy! Thanks.

Fav of the day - 93A.

Et. seq. - HATED today's NYT paper version. To those that solve on-line - it's a layout gimmick relating to the 'High Life' theme of this week's magazine. Think vertical? It felt like writing on a wall calendar.. meh.

Chaos344 10:14 AM  

LMAO! Almost 9:30 AM and no comments posted yet!

See what happens when Rex goes away? Yesterday we had around 35 posts explaining OSCAR, and a ton more explaining MTWTF. Speaking of that, laugh of the day goes to @Casey for the following:

"My answer for 48 down-- MT.WTF. This mountain is well known to puzzle fans."

Post of the day to @Lobster11 for being proud of himself, as well he should be. Way to go Lobster! The length of time it took is irrelevant.You persevered and beat the puzzle. Lots of laughs in your post too! Don't feel too bad about agonizing over MISSIDAHO. It was a classic misdirection. People always forget that there is a Moscow in Idaho. They also forget that there is a Paris and an Odessa in Texas, and a Toledo in Spain as well as Ohio. There is a state of Georgia on another continent too, and I just skimmed the surface.

Agree with Rex about today's puzzle, although the theme made my head hurt. I don't like to think that hard on Sunday.

The best part of Rex's critique was the Rhino picture and yet another excellent definition of SRO. They say a Rhino's olfactory senses enable him to detect a female in heat at a distance of over 200 miles? I'm assuming he gets right down to business once the object of his affection is within sight? After running 200 miles, ogling seems ridiculous!

Have a great Sunday! Do something interesting.Maybe climb MT.WTF? ;>)

oconomowoc 10:16 AM  

Wow. It's harder than it looks to come up with original themers.

..."Cleaver" or "robe" (9 letters)

..."high" or "yellow brick" (15 letters)

..."Sunday" or "old" (9 letters)

G.Harris 10:17 AM  

It was not fair to cross Shlh Chinng with whoopie Spelt with two ees. I didn't even know I was wrong until the computer told me.Therefore, technically I dnf.

Unknown 10:17 AM  

PS The card I got from @Rex gives me a clue as to why he got the Joon Phak Award. :>)

In his defense, it was nonetheless completely legible.

RooMonster 10:20 AM  

Hey All !
Nice SunPuz fare. A tad high on Blocks (80), due mainly to cheater squares, but that's OK. Light on dreck. Leaned on the easy side of medium. BEAR UP kinda odd. Lots of Double O's, most concentrated in NE. Just a couple of writeovers, EXtolS-EXALTS, JAWliNE-JAWBONE.

Liked it, not-too-brain-taxing. Good U count for M&A, plus a HAR HAR!

Just the BASICS

Wick 10:22 AM  

Downgrade Medium to Easy for me. Enjoyed the theme. Only trouble was in SW with POSTERN (old-timey word, no?) crossing ECO (always forget Umberto). It was my last square to fill so guessing vowels got me to victory.

Teedmn 10:27 AM  

I finished Saturday's puzzle this morning (only with very liberal use of the 'Check' button) and then started in on today's. I agree with @Rex that the theme seems vaguely familiar but I enjoyed it very much. It took a long time before I could get enough crosses to see what was going on, which happened at BEFORE LONG (ironic, no?).

A lot of nice clues, like 'Result of hitting the bar" or "Too big for one's britches, say" or "Flames that have gone out" so nota CUTESY puzzle, but some HAR HAR. I did have to wonder if Tom McCoy lives a horror movie-like existence, if a FOOTSTEP is a "Suspenseful sound" :-).

chefbea 10:40 AM  

Never did figure out the theme and still really understand it. I too thought we were going to search for words within the themers. Safe ride home @Rex

Ken Wurman 10:54 AM  

Nice fun puzzle! My own clue: "in the dark" and "worm".. Answer: after glow..

jae 11:04 AM  

Medium for me too. Clever/delightful theme, smooth grid, liked it a lot! Or exactly what Rex said.

JD 11:15 AM  

Opinions vary in this blog along a fairly wide spectrum every day. But a puzzle like this sets the standard for the kind of puz experience that we all show up for, a good brain workout with rewarding ah ha moments, fun for fans of all ages (and you can guess mine from that old tv commercial pitch line). More of that Will Shortz.

JD 11:18 AM  

And no and no drek.

Lobster11 11:22 AM  

@Chaos344 - Thanks for the compliments on yesterday's post. I enjoyed writing that almost as much as I did finishing the puzzle, but I got in so late (there were 85 comments when I submitted it) that I feared no one would see it!

Anonymous 11:27 AM  

Does anyone here do the puns and anagrams puzzle in the times? I feel so good to have solved it. Found it crunchier than today's xword puzzle. found the 90 degree flip of the mag section rather irksome!

Unknown 11:56 AM  

I had a lot of fun solving this one and it turned out to be a lot easier than I'm used to, probably because the interest level kept me in the game and it didn't feel like a slog.

Kimberly 12:43 PM  

"Cutesy," "whoopee," and "whee." "Toodleoo" crossing "Yoo-hoo." I felt like I was solving a puzzle constructed by a pasty, middle-aged woman wearing sparkly eyeshadow and a fairy tee shirt who has seven cats and signs all her online posts "huggles!"

Nancy 1:00 PM  

@Marushka -- Great that you mentioned the incredibly irritating and ridiculous layout of the Sunday Times magazine today. Like you, I was immensely annoyed by it, and meant to mention it in my comment, but I was getting ready to watch the French Open Men's Final, and I forgot. I do plan to go to Wordplay, the Times's website, and file a complaint there. WS is more likely to see it and perhaps complain to the Mag's editor, assuming he hasn't complained already.

As promised, I'm back to provide the details of Dorothy Parker's response to CUTESY: "Tonstant Weader fwowed up." It was in her review of A.A. Milne's "The House on Pooh Corner". If you Google "A Pooh too hummy," you'll find an interesting, amusing article, along with a word, worthy of a Saturday crossword puzzle, that I'll lay 100-1 odds none of you have ever heard of. I certainly hadn't. Or should I just tell you now? Oh, OK, you talked me into it. HYPOCORISMA. If you want to know more, read the article.

Mohair Sam 1:01 PM  

What @Lobster11 said, word for word.

Would like to add a tip of the cap to Rex for his award, proof that I wasn't in the competition. And a second nod to his choice of wine, what else would you order at a crossword tournament? Neat.

@Z - No they're not one-hit-wonders, wise guy. But that hit has 265,000,000 You Tube views, I'll be even Nancy knows it.

Woke up this morning feeling miserable - loaded with antibiotics for a miserable nagging cold. Best Sunday puzzle in a while cheered me up, along with Rex's comments - thanks guys.

Susan 1:14 PM  

Best puzzle in a while for me. Smooth going the whole way with many smiles as I cracked the clues. Thanks Tom McCoy and all you posters who I so enjoy reading.

old timer 1:15 PM  

On the road to celebrate my newest grandson's first birthday so I'll be brief. I loved the puzzle. Tough but fair. It really helped that I knew MASALA and OOMPA. And what a quinceanera celebrates.

I was alarmed by the odd shape of the magazine this week but I think it made solving easier.

Churlish Nabob 1:16 PM  

A welcome and all too rare non-slog Sunday. @Maruchka, agree that today's magazine format is extremely annoying.

Jim Finder 1:18 PM  

I enjoyed the puzzle for most of the same reasons as the other posters. The theme required a bit more thinking than the average Sunday, and the rest was clean and fair.

mac 1:48 PM  

One of the nicest Sunday puzzles today. I also recall some similar word theme a couple of years ago, but I
enjoyed doing this one.

It was odd to have to read the magazine 90 degrees off, but my puzzle somehow looks a lot neater than it usually does!

The Indie in Washington looks great! Sorry I couldn't go, but I'm looking forward to Lollapuzzoola in August.

Hungry Mother 1:50 PM  

I fretted over the NW until it finally fell, then the SE was the last to fill in.

Dorothy Biggs 2:00 PM  

I did this on my phone and I still came in way below average. I still don't quite understand the theme, but no worries. I solved it (quickly) without even caring.

And Eroica us delicious.

Sheryl 2:16 PM  

Enjoyed this puzzle very much. Clever cluing, quite a few laughs, clever theme, no problem finishing (very little in the way of the dreaded PPP).

Rabi Abonour 2:16 PM  

Blew through this one. It's cute in the way I hope for on Sunday, but very easy. Definitely some questionable fill, though. Maybe some people like TOODLEOO crossing YOOHOO, but it made me cringe - especially in a grid that also has WHOOPEE and WHEE.

Anonymous 2:29 PM  

I always think of M&A whenever I come across a U in any puzzle (there's another little darlin' for him), but it's a special treat to get two HARs.

Anonymous 3:05 PM  

Fastest time for a Sunday crossword for me, WHOOPEE! Got caught up with TOODLEOO and thought I would get a dnf and said "AW NUTS" before it dawned on me. WHEE!. Thought "Issuer of IDs" was a poor clue choice in a puzzle that has "IDTAGS" as an answer, but that's a minor gripe in what was a thoroughly enjoyable puzzle. It was a little CUTESY, but that's fine on a lazy Sunday, and THAT'S THAT.

Masked and Anonymous 3:08 PM  

Primo SunPuz. Fun theme. Solid fill. 10 U's. 2 har's. (yo, @Roo) Rodeo. thUmbsUp.

@indie009: Day-um. Confuses the M&A. Will wait for the post-tourney write-up, to decide whether to go with @indie#??, @mr.penmanship, or @Eroica.breath.



Nancy 4:17 PM  

@Mohair (1:01 pm) -- Oh, @Mohair, please tell me you didn't bet the farm -- or even your shirt --on my knowing A-ha. Because you have ignominiously lost, my friend. To me, AHA is a moment, not a singer (or is it a band? a musical group?) I had to Google A-ha to find out that there are songs attached to whatever person or persons have that name. Many, many songs. Many, many songs -- not one of which I have ever heard of. You're the victim of a sucker bet, @Mohair, and I can't imagine who talked you into it. Or maybe it was illness that caused such bad, bad judgment. At any rate, feel better soon! But never EVER again bet good cash money on my knowledge of pop music. You'll lose every time.

Charles Flaster 4:21 PM  

Great write up Rex.
I have seen other positioning words ( BETWEEN, NEXT TO , AHEAD OF etc..)
but never like this type of two words.
Really enjoyed the theme and clue for FOOTSTEP.
Thanks TM

Hartley70 4:29 PM  

I'm guessing you paper solvers had to open the magazine like a wall calendar? My phone app and I are sorry to have missed that novelty.

I'll add my voice to the chorus singing PAEANS to Mr. McCoy. BTW that word was my final entry. RHINO hit me out of left field. The theme was a corker! One of the best Sundays I can remember!

Mohair Sam 5:39 PM  

Oh yeah, forgot my one beef:
If 121A Private property? (IDTAGS) is referring to military privates the correct answer is "dog" TAGS. I still use the ones I was issued in the '60s as a key ring - at least if I'm unconscious from an accident they'll know when I had my last tetanus shot.

Anonymous 10:44 PM  

What a wonderful, wonderful Monday puzzle!

Tita 12:32 AM  

Count me in for rolling my eyes at the thought of a word search style puzzle.
So happy to be mistaken.
Clue for RHINO made my day.

Apropos nothing, stop by the New Britain Museum of American Art. A real gem, with a small but significant collection. They have just begun a series of special exhibits on the Shakers in CT. Beautiful furnishings and household items for the opening.
Many admirable beliefs that this group adheres to, but they do seem to be doomed by their requirement of celibacy.

Thanks Mr. McCoy.

kitshef 8:28 AM  

Had I known there were prizes for worst handwriting I would have been at every competition for the last 50 years.

In the case of The House at Pooh Corner, Parker was dead wrong.

PatKS 1:54 AM  

Hated this puzzle and the calendar layout. Finished quick with no cheats. Boring as hell.

Unknown 8:45 PM  

Help me understand 49D racy magazines....maxims. I don't get it!

PeterThomas 11:48 AM  

Just one comment/question. How does Ta-Da become Toodleoo??? I got this by the crosses but it makes not one bit sense. bob

Peter Strauss 8:09 PM  

Stephen M: Re: racy magazines/Maxims --

Very enjoyable puzzle, and I agree with Rex's comments.

Tita 9:47 AM  

@Teedmn and syndilanders...good luck at the tournament! Post pics pls.

Burma Shave 10:26 AM  


You said, “WHOOPEE” and “WHEE” and THATSTHAT, you were gone,
I CANSEE what went wrong, ITOO came AHEADOFTIME.


spacecraft 10:59 AM  

Very conversational stuff today; you can't say any of this isn't "in the language," from YOOHOO to TOODLEOO and from AWNUTS to WHOOPEE. (Well, maybe TOODLEOO feels restricted to elderly British ladies.) But it all adds to the fun. Racking my brain for that first themer, I didn't think of SUIT until finally figuring out that the "doc" in the 10-down clue wasn't "doctor" but "document." I myself haven't seen "document" shortened in that way. But that was maybe the toughest part.

All of the theme entries are very clever, and Mr. McCoy UNLEASHES plenty of sparkling fill--the clues to which are mostly misdirected, but with enough gimmes sprinkled throughout that it never bogged me down. One might go to the redoubtable MAE West for DOD, but why not take MAE as clued: the luscious Sherilyn Fenn who played her in the film? Oh to be Lenny!

Easy-easy-medium, a joy to solve. An "un-slog!" Eagle.

rondo 11:03 AM  

Before I comment on the puz let me just say I spent a wonderful afternoon yesterday traipsing around Saint Paul with @teedMN and @Diana, LIW. So nice to meet folks from crossworld in person. And today (in syndi-time) even more goings on at the MN Xword Tourney; it’s relatively CLOSETOHOME. Really nice weekend.

This puz is what we should expect on a Sunday, funnish theme and nary a rebus square in sight. Maybe seemed a bit heavy on the three letter answers and those CUTESY words sure used up a lot of double vowels, but what the HECKLE.

I’ll go back to SNL twenty years ago, or so, for yeah baby CHERI Oteri. I would tune in to get a WEEKLY dose of her.

Nice little wordplay theme and BETWEENYOUANDME, I liked it.

AnonymousPVX 2:27 PM  

Stephen M - Pick up any issue of MAXIM magazine and you'll instantly understand.

Nicely constructed and clued. Not really gimmicky. I enjoyed it.

Huggles! Hahaha, my new word.

rain forest 4:00 PM  

Let's make it (almost) unanimous: terrific puzzle. I agree with all the favourable comments.

Just one silly, but niggling issue, ie, what is @Rex's real standing as a crossword solver? He has been 009 for a year, but finished somewhere in the 50's at the recent ACPT and never owned up to it. I suppose his finish at the Indie 500 may see him change his ranking, at least if it is a better finish than at the ACPT. Shallow.

Sailor 11:29 PM  

The most engaging theme in a good long time. Otherwise, a relatively easy puzzle, but I laughed out loud more than once, so very high marks for entertainment value!

Phillip Blackerby 3:01 AM  

Same here

Anonymous 9:33 AM  

With a little extra "word search" you will notice unrelated words within each theme answer: closet/lose/set/me; ton/not/thin; head/ado/oft; low/win/wing; etc.

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