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Relative difficulty: Challenging
Theme answers:
- WHIS(KEY) JUG (3D: Moonshine container)
- MON(KEY) PAW (9D: Jordan Peele's production company, named for a classic horror short story)
- DON(KEY) KONG (36D: 1981 video game that featured the first appearance of Mario)
- TUR(KEY) DAY (40D: Thanksgiving)
E-girls and e-boys, sometimes collectively known as e-kids, are a youth subculture that emerged in the late 2010s, notably popularized by the video-sharing app TikTok. It is an evolution of emo, scene and mall goth fashion combined with Japanese street fashion (such as anime, cosplay, kawaii and lolita fashion) and K-pop fashion.
Videos by e-girls and e-boys tend to be flirtatious and, many times, overtly sexual. Eye-rolling and protruding tongues (a facial expression known as ahegao, imitating climaxing) are common.
According to Business Insider, the terms are not gender-specific, instead referring to two separate styles of fashion, stating that "While the e-boy is a vulnerable 'softboi' and embraces skate culture, the e-girl is cute and seemingly innocent". (wikipedia)
• • •
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| [I was *this* far before I "got" the theme] |
[Impostor syndrome feeling] is way, way, way too specific a clue for DOUBT. Without the SELF- in front of DOUBT, it actually feels just flat-out wrong. If I've heard of E-BOY, I forgot, and as I read about it (see "Word of the Day" entry, above), it was clear why I forgot. My brain was protecting me from things I shouldn't know. TikTok is a lot of rich tech guys getting richer by selling screen addiction and mental health problems disguised as youth agency (fun! empowerment! youth!). But I'm old so my opinions are easily ignorable. I do get it. But I'll take "old guy who is highly suspicious of TikTok" to "non-teen pretending to be down with TikTok in a desperate attempt to be relevant." Anyway, the deleterious effects of TikTok (and other forms of social media) are well known, even if you choose to ignore them. Here's Amanda Hess in the NYT:
Besides the whole NOOB fiasco, the worst mistake-pit I fell in was the GAS / GEL pit ... which is to say I wrote in GAS and then "confirmed" it with GEL before ultimately realizing the answers were actually HAY and HAT, respectively (34A: Fuel for a mustang? / 34D: Solution to a bad hair day). The lowercase "m" on "mustang" should've clued me in that it wasn't the car, but ... I solve before 5am, so sometimes, the wires, the brain wires, they have connectivity issues. Last thing I'll say is that MURMUR is not a [Soothing sound]. It's an annoying inaudible speech sound. Or it implies rumor / gossip, which can suck. At best, it's an R.E.M. album. COOING is a [Soothing sound]. I guess a brook can MURMUR pleasantly, but unless I am standing right next to Wordsworth, I am not apt to make the MURMUR-"soothing" connection. See you tomorrow.
ReplyDeleteFor once I'm in complete agreement with @Rex. His mistakes were my mistakes, his slog was my slog. I'm not a total stranger to Jewish cuisine. I know about Kasha Varnishkes and Stuffed Derma, but KISHKA -- which appears to be another word for Stuffed Derma -- was new to me. Fell face first into the NooB (87 million Google hits) / NEWB (9 million) trap. Do the Mets need a NEW B for their B TEAM of pitchers?
Smile and beam can be verbs
Delete“Smile big” would have made more sense.
DeleteAlso had NOOB for the longest time. Just wouldn't compute it could be anything else, even as EON became more and more apparent. Also, odd that BTEAM was in pretty much the same place in the grid the day before...
ReplyDeleteI agree with Rex that there was some sketchy clueing and fill but I saw the theme right away with the whiskey jug/okeydoke cross, and there was enough gimme fill crossing the sketchy ones that I sailed through this. The “key” crosses were all solid. Enjoyed this.
ReplyDeleteWow, yay me, @Rex calls it challenging and here it was one of my fastest ever Thursdays.
ReplyDeleteI think that's because I had OKEYDOKE in, even though I wasn't positive but I used to work with someone who said it all. the. time. and somehow the KEY popped out at me over JUG and that was all it took.
I don't see the puzz titles in the NYT app, so not sure if that would have helped.
Very confused by NEWB, never seen it spelled that way. Put in the N and B (obvious) and waited for crosses.
Kinda what @Rex said about BEAM. It isn't used that way. You could say that she was beaming with joy over her awesome solve, or maybe even that his face was abeam, but I can't come up with a sentence where BEAM can sub for smile or grin. But I'll bet someone can!
Note: 6:30 EDT, I see Rex at 5:50 and zero comments.
@Smith 6:37 AM - The weekday puzzles do not have titles.
DeleteTough puzzle. A non-rebus rebus that ABSORBed a lot of time before I TURNed onto the gimmick.
ReplyDeleteLike Rex, expected NooB over NEWB.
May add elude/evade/AVOID to the pantheon of KEALOAs.
My wife will certainly appreciate the HOCKEY MOM x CHEYENNES cross, as she is both of those.
At 0:11 below average, a solid medium for me, but ultimately solvable and reasonably fair.
A red-letter day: I agree with Rex completely (especially the anti-TikTok rant). A perfectly good puzzle marred by sloppy clueing. I put the blame on the editors, not the constructors. But part of the blame for my slow solve time is squarely on me. I was annoyed that the puzzle had a Great Plains clue for CHerokeeS, only to realize that the mistake was all mine.
ReplyDeleteHigh "Huh?" factor
ReplyDeleteOutstanding Puzzle! (JC's POW). Rex took some potshots today but didn't seem to really analyze the puzzle. NEWB has appeared before, though less frequently than NooB. I can't see how UNIONIzeS fits the clue(Organized workers) better than UNIONISTS. It really doesn't fit at all. I also don't see that it's a misdirect type clue as Rex claims. He didn't like BEAM or DOUBT. Again, I don't see a problem. I thoroughly enjoyed this one.
ReplyDeleteI finally caved and looked up 9A. Seriously?? McJob? I guess it's a thing, but I've never heard of it, and hope I never do again. After that, I was able to complete that corner. Did you know that Shoshones fits just fine for the Plains People? Oops.
ReplyDeleteTried to cram a rebus in all of those key intersections even though it was ugly. The game would not let me finish until i replaced the rebi key with a simple e. It was still ugly. Do not recommend.
ReplyDeleteThe short story is actually "The Monkey's Paw".
ReplyDeleteWhen the answer to 1 across revealed itself to be clearly wrong, I just decided...nope, not gonna do this one today.
ReplyDeleteAhh, the soothing sound of a heart MURMUR.
ReplyDeleteAgree that BEAM is a verb, so that clue did not work for me.
A little disappointed overall. When the gimmick does the same thing in every case, it's not as fun as when it is different in each case. Once you get the KEY thing it's more mechanical chore than puzzle.
Newb is not a thing. Noob is.
ReplyDeleteI was expecting something more from the theme
Meh
The hill I died on today was being convinced that any song about pirates must have "yo-ho-ho" in it somewhere (as in "Yo-ho-ho and a bottle of rum") and therefore the "words sung twice" must be hOHO instead of yOHO. NHU seemed a perfectly valid university to have a library named after somebody I've never heard of, so that didn't help.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous 7:27 AM - As a native New Yorker who only applied to NYU, Columbia, CUNY, and SUNY for college (in 1978!), I did not look askance at the Bobst clue for NYU; but now that you mention it, yeah, that's a gimme-a-break clue (the opposite of a gimme, I guess). I wonder if [Sch. in Greenwich Village] would have been more evocative for non-New Yorkers?
DeleteNever been to Disneyland, eh…?
DeleteVery disappointing that the puzzle has become a trivia contest. This one consists of 18 pop culture phrases or things along 3 proper names of movie actors and 1 comic book writer. I'm not even counting borderline ones (HOCKEYMOM, SEGO, MIA) or the descent into words that might be thought gross, or at least that never used to be considered crossword fodder.
ReplyDeleteTrying to be "relevant" by dumbing down seems like a bad idea.
@Shirley F 7:33 AM - I agree with you in principle. As I often say here, I don't agree that the kinds of entries in question are necessarily "trivia." These entries are not obscure per se; they are what I call "generational," meaning you need to be of a particular generation for the information to be part of your knowledge repertoire. Older folks will get KANE, younger folks will get MCJOB. But I do agree that crosswords are classically based on wordplay far more than on factual knowledge. And I agree that the current trend towards over-reliance on culturally specific factual knowledge is regrettable. Classic crosswords cultivate wit; crosswords based on generational knowledge cultivate smug self-satisfaction among those in the target demographic, and frustration and disappointment among everyone else.
DeleteOh, that’s one lovely concept – TURNKEYS -- golden, or better yet, spun gold.
ReplyDeleteThough it took a lot of effort to pull off, according to the constructors’ notes, there’s no sense of strain in the final puzzle; it feels like it was dashed off on a cozy day. That takes skill. Also, OREO/OREOS has been in the NYT puzzle more than 500 times, yet never clued with the “cream” and “chocolate” letters connection. Bravo to that!
The rebus hairs on my neck stood on end early on, but the rebus-less solution, IMO, is far more elegant. Plus, the puzzle gave me enough Thursday bite to satisfy my love of figuring things out.
Elegance and satisfaction, a sweet combination, making for one terrific journey. Thank you, Lucy and Ross!
Just the inclusion of [Marisa of "My Cousin Vinny"] / TOMEI makes this worth the price of admission. How can you not love that?
ReplyDeletePlus - I thought this was a very clever puzzle; I loved it.
The clue for MONKEYPAW is "Jordan Peele's production company, named for a classic horror short story". MONKEY PAW is indeed the name of his production company so the clue/answer are correct. Yes, the story is "The Monkey's Paw" but that's irrelevant.
ReplyDeleteDefinitely not challenging - the trick fell with the WHISKEY JUG x OKEY DOKE cross. Theme and revealer were fine - I just thought the rest of the puzzle was flat. CHEYENNES is decent but ROBOT KITS, EMMA STONE and UNIONISTS take up a lot of real estate for non theme material. Not sure who thought they were good entries.
ReplyDeleteWeird to see OHARE and TOMEI again this week. Liked ENURES but agree with Rex on MURMUR being more annoying than soothing.
The Bobst has been on my shit list for a long time. Fiercely fought when it was being proposed - it looms over the SE corner of the park. Not pleasing to the eye - just a large box blocking the morning and midday sun. An ugly addition to this grid.
I liked the theme here - too bad the rest of the puzzle didn’t hold up.
@Son Volt 8:02 AM - You have a shit list! I do, too. I learned that concept from my mother, may her memory be for a blessing. My soon-to-be-ex husband HATED it—But that may have been because most of the people on my shit list were his friends LOL. Today's puzzle is far from among my favorites, but your comment almost makes it worthwhile.
Delete@Smith 6:37. It's not your app; the NYTimes does not have crossword titles, except on Sundays.
ReplyDelete@kitshef 8:12
DeleteBeen doing them on the phone, ex Sun, for so long I completely forgot that!
Am I the only one who has never seen the word “decoct” before? Tried “reduce” at first so got slowed down but still beat my average.
ReplyDeleteI have to say I enjoyed this one, mostly for its entertainment value. Opened it up and saw Elmer Holmes Bobst and thought "Well, if ever there were an a-list celeb or dignitary worthy of a NYT shout-out, he's your guy" - so I suspected it was going to be one of "those" days, and the rest of the puzzle did not disappoint.
ReplyDeleteI then noticed that (apparently) Jordan Peele has a production company - so I tirelessly slogged my way through the NE with baited breath until I parsed together a MONKEY PAW - which was disappointing. I did get a chuckle from today's very bizarre made-up-word (MCJOB), realizing that it has got to be difficult for the Times to keep sinking to new lows with the made-up stuff on such a consistent basis.
I absolutely loved the subtle irony of crossing a Latin phrase (DEUS) with DUMB ASS - managing to be high-brow and low-brow in the same 4x4 mini-section is truly impressive.
I did feel a little sad for DECOCT, who had a solid shot for made-up word for today - but everybody knows that when Mickey Dees sets their mind on something they do it in a big way, but DECOCT was a worthy runner-up.
Actually it's bated (not baited) breath ... just sayin'
DeleteMy main exposure to KISHKA comes from the polka standard "Who Stole The Kishka?", a classic rendition of which can be found here. I married a Wisconsin native, so have become ENURED to polka music. Kishka are also popular in Eastern Europe among non-Jewish people as well.
ReplyDeleteI had the same experience. My dad was in a polka band (Chicago area) in the ‘30s-‘60s and this was a popular hit for them to play!! I went to utube and listened to it as well!!!
DeleteI can't believe Rex doesn't know the sardonically irreverent revue "Dybbich Schymbbich I Said More Ham" by the late Chaim Pearlgut featuring the hit song Bubi Made a Kishka.
ReplyDeleteHave never heard any one use the term McJob. Ever. And now that I know what it means, I don’t like it. Would be happy never to hear it or see it in the puzzle again.
ReplyDelete@Phillyrad1999 8:37 AM - As a vocabulary item, MGJOB rubs me the wrong way, too. But conceptually, it's fascinating. It perfectly captures the existential crisis of the Zoomer generation. I think it's us Boomers who are revolted by the term, because it seems to give too much "kavod" (Hebrew/Yiddish for respect or reverence) to one of the most nefarious names in consumerist culture. It's sad and frightening. Those kids deserve our sympathy and compassion. We dealt them a pretty messed up hand.
DeleteFWIW, MCJOB was popularized by Douglas Coupland in 1991, when he wrote Generation X. Which is to say, it’s initially for my generation, but we’re used to being overlooked ;)
DeleteI kind of delighted at seeing it in the grid.
FWIW, MCJOB was popularized by Douglas Coupland in 1991, with his novel Generation X. I kind of delighted at seeing it in the grid, but sure, give the existential crisis to the Zoomers. My generation is used to being overlooked. ENUREd, even ;)
DeleteNEWB - TKOD - MCJOB - YOHO - MINI - GPA - MIA - EEK - DICTA - DEUS - LGBT...
ReplyDeleteI don't know. I seem to detect "a sense of strain" in this one.
I have some vague memory of a song called "Who stole the kishka". I think the thief was "Yasha".
Hiya, @BunnyR, learned MCJOB from past Xwords🙄, but now find it a useful word.
ReplyDeleteAnd @Anonymous 7:27, did the same with HOHO, but since I lived in New England for decades, remembered the school in NH is UNH, not NHU.
Maybe BEAM works in a sense because smile can be a verb: the sun beaming down, the sun smiling down....???
Still beaming from yesterday's puzzle. Really liked those phrases changed by commas. Happy Friday Eve.
Very familiar with Kishka. It’s an old-school food but my FIL insisted it be served at our wedding. We had fun teasing our friends to guess what it was.
ReplyDeleteGoodness, OFL is grumpy primate this morning. I considered NOOB briefly but when it was obvious that wouldn't work, switched to NEWB, apparently unacceptable to some but fine by me. Wanted WHISKEYJAR at first, couldn't see how the KEY part was supposed to fit in, crossed over to what had to be HOCKEYMOM, guessed MONKEYPAW, and there's your Thursday gimmick right there and the rest was making it work.
ReplyDeleteEBOY? News to me. Never had a ROCKETKIT, and I would prefer "silver" to GRAY, but that's just wishful thinking. A BEAM is not a smile but the "big" part led me to it so didn't bother to deconstruct that one.
And haven't I seen JADA Pinkett Smith around somewhere lately? Something happen at some kind of awards ceremony? I need to do some research.
I thought this one was clever and amusing, LH and RT Like Having a Real Thursday for a change. Thanks for all the fun.
I couldn’t mention yesterday that the revealer COMMA was the day’s Wordle solution. Someone mentioned synchronicity. Unfortunately I went with TIDAL for my starter word.
ReplyDelete@Drubytue 8:45am. Haha! I’m glad it didn’t help you. Wasn’t that insane? The Puzzle and Games Dept needs to put down the pencils and talk!
DeleteNice tricky puzzle. Very enjoyable. Much more enjoyable than one of Rex's rants about things that must be wrong because he doesn't understand them. My dictionary has BEAM as a noun meaning a big grin, It also MURMUR as a low sound, and I certainly murmured to my son when he was a baby. Oh, and there are thousands of people who have purchased and enjoyed ROBOT KITS. Sheesh.
ReplyDeleteCome on guys, you can’t be that old. I’m 34 and “newb” has been around for 20 plus years. Surely you’ve used the Internet once or twice or maybe just maybe played a video game in that time span. Bunch of crosswording newbs here.
ReplyDeleteI wasn't sure whether to rebus key or just put an e in those boxes. It was not much of a streak to have ruined, but to have it ruined by that . . .
ReplyDeleteThx Lucy & Ross; a fine Thurs. puz! :)
ReplyDeleteMed.
To KEY or not to KEY; that was the rebus question. I never mind not having to do the rebus thing. lol
Otherwise, pretty straightforward, with the exception of the KISHKA / OKEY DOKE cross. Originally had OKaY DOnE, then getting the KEY idea, changed to the correct crosses.
EBOY was new, but the crosses were solid.
Very enjoyable romp.
–––
Peace 🙏 🇺🇦 ~ Compassion ~ Tolerance ~ Kindness to all 🕊
I think the app and web version could have accepted the four as "KEY" rebuses (rebi?)... couldn't get it completed because it was Thursday, therefore rebus day, and so that's what I used until autocheck revealed those as just "E".
ReplyDeleteHad NhU instead of NYU and hOHO instead of YOHO. Duh! I never heard of New Hampshire University but I went with it. And I’m a NYer. Ugh. Had no problem w NEWB - I’ve seen it plenty. I did say to myself early on that the puzzle seemed to have an inordinate amount of “K”s in it. Got the trick at DONkEyKONG crossing TURNKEY and from there it was easy. Never realized my mistake until I got here, I solve with the newspaper.
ReplyDeleteSince it is a shortening of NEWBie, my only problem with NEWB is having a slang kealoa at 1A. Noob is what you say when you want to imply that not only are they new, but also a bit of a boob. Get your pejorative slang nuance right, people.*
ReplyDeleteAs for TikTok - Jeezuz. Comics. Rock and Roll. D&D. Seriously? Now social media? Nothing says someone is more hipreplacementer than hipster than complaining about the new thing being dangerous for kids. Is there any question that Juliet would be on TikTok? Or that we’d be blaming TikTok and not the family’s feud for her death. Guess what. Teens are hormonally enriched. Their emotions are all over the place. They will do stupid things and overly dramatic things and potentially obsess over things they shouldn’t obsess over. It’s not the thing, it’s the teens. Billy Bard knew this. Why don’t we?
Oh yeah, the puzzle - Skipped past the kealoa and started in the NE. O’HARE and MCJOB got me going, but it wasn’t until I had worked back into the NW that the penny dropped with WHISKEY JUG. The puzzle got much easier from there. No particular issue with BEAM. Her smile was like a BEAM of sunshine… a tired metaphor but that just means it is crossworthy. My only writeover was trEES before EPÉES. Personally, I like trees as “sticking points” a lot better.
**Wordle Alert**
🤣😂🤣😂🤣
Way to spawn conspiracy theories NYT Games people. Was that an example of a comma splice, yesterday?
*I got this slight twinge that someone will not notice that there’s actually no difference between newb and noob and believe me.
My sentiments exactly! Tiktok. Instagram. Facebook. The internet. TV. Video games. Music I don't get. Comics. The telephone. Movies. Electricity. The printing press...
Delete13D definitely should have been "Smile big" ... first time I've encountered a verb *trying* to be clued as a noun but still hinting at the verb form. I agree this puzzle felt a little clunky!
ReplyDeleteUg.
ReplyDeleteNEWB: spelled wrong.
TKOD: no.
UNIONISTS: what? that's not how any of this works.
OKEYDOKE: spelled wrong. I am not sure how to spell it, but not like that.
ENURES: spelled wrong. it's INURES (right??).
METRO(sexual): was a dumb dumb dumb concept in 1990, it's just sad in 2022.
JADA: we don't need to hear from the Smith family for about three years.
DECOCT: when you see this in your construction do you not just close your laptop and walk away?
ROBOTKITS: nope.
EBOY: Blech with a capital B.
FAM: is who are NOT peeps.
MURMUR: the opposite of a soothing sound.
OREOS: without OBOES are just sad.
BEAM: verb for noun.
OH, and you CAN'T turn the KEY without pulling open the vertical answer first to make room for two more letters. Here's a case where it SHOULD have been a rebus and wasn't.
I am wanting the NYT to start publishing the names of the real editors (McJob editors) rather than the executive editor (WS) because I'm convinced this puzzle was rushed to print because Jada is in it and WS just rubber stamped it. I DOUBT he's reviewing these in depth and is relying on his team, and somebody on the team is phoning it in.
Yay:
MCJOB: I've done that work plenty in life and it's where I am usually happiest.
SEGO lillies: Aren't they pretty (?) and remind me of Harry Potter's mom.
ANTSY: I like that word.
EEK: Always funny.
EMMASTONE and Marisa TOMEI: They both seem nice.
DICTA DEUS ENOS all in a row.
Finally, people wearing sunglasses in their profile pictures, ehem Ross... go ahead and take them off while they take your photo. It's not that bright right now and it's never been a "cool" look even for rock stars, and you're not a rock star.
@Anonymous 7:27am
ReplyDeleteThe pirate song in question isn't the 'bottle of rum' one, but the one from the Disney ride, Pirates of the Caribbean. It's the OTHER ear worm you'll have in your head all day after you've finally purged that "It's a Small World" one.
MCJOB and McMansion are the two big terms, but putting MC in front of anything is a thing. Interchangeable. Uninteresting. Offensive in its plebeian inoffensiveness. Tasteless in the sense of nothing to recommend it, but also nothing overtly offensive about it so there are lots of it. MCJOB has been around since 1986 and McMansion since 1990 so neither are hardly new terms. And I have definitely heard the Mc prefix applied to other things to suggest that same kind of offensive plebeian inoffensive in other areas.
ReplyDeleteI gave up about halfway through the puzzle as I just wasn’t feeling it. But one note: “newb” and “noob” mean (or can mean) slightly different, but related, things. A “newb” is simply someone who is inexperienced and is learning. “Noob” or “n00b” has more the connotation of being a clueless idiot who will never learn from their mistakes to it, as well. Now, context can blur these meanings, but that’s how I remember it. Checking myself with online sources seems to confirm this distinction. So, “noob” definitely has the feel of “newb(ie)” + “boob,” whereas “newb” is just a shortening of “newbie”.
ReplyDeleteThis puzzle drove me crazy and I ended up not being able to solve it. Because 10D had to be either CHEROKEES or CHEYENNES (I had CHEROKEES for much, much longer) and each answer futzed up a different cross or two.
ReplyDeleteCHEROKEES worked perfectly with sOCcEr MOM (which I had for my entire non-solve), but CHEROKEES wouldn't allow either STAND or FLOWN to be right -- and I was sure they both were.
CHEYENNES worked with STAND and FLOWN, but it made SOCCER MOM impossible. What to do? I froze. I did nothing at all.
SOCCER MOM (which I never questioned, not even once) also gave me KISs?A for the stuffed Jewish dish. You all had trouble with KISHKA? Imagine how much more trouble you would have had with KISSKA.
I did manage to correct fIaTs to DICTA at 58A in order to get TURKEY DAY. So there's that.
Looking at the grid, this doesn't seem like a TURNKEY puzzle so much as a PASS-THROUGH KEY puzzle. The rotation thing doesn't really do it for me. But maybe I'm just sulking over SOCCER MOM.
Hey All !
ReplyDeleteNeat theme, even though the clue for the Revealer is weird. I know TURN KEYS as either businesses for sale ready to go, needing nothing but a new owner, or an automobile already restored. I can see the Jailers angle, but still odd.
Or maybe I'm odd. (Bet the over on that.)
Took me to the Revealer/DONEKONG to see what was happening. Then glanced over at JOCKEYFOR/TUREDAY for confirmation. Aha, says I, the KEYs are TURNt.
I have heard of MCJOB. Yay me.
I haven't heard of a KISHKA. Boo me.
EBOY, Hoo Boy. Kids these days.
ABSORB neat to see. Rare puz word. Haven't looked at stats, but with the two B's, including one at the end, doesn't exactly fit into too many slots. EEK was funly clued. (Why isn't funly a word?)
Real silly DNF today. SaGO/KANa. *Insert balloon deflating sound here*
Strange puz for me in the fact that first past through, had only a few answers sprinkled throughput the grid, said "uh-oh, gonna be a toughie", but ended up quite quick at 18 minutes. I know it's not my puz solving skills. Or brain power for that matter.
yd -3, should'ves 0
Two F's
RooMonster
DarrinV
@Z You left out "shaudenfruede" in your footnote. Without it, some might feel that it was a twinge of regret.
ReplyDeleteMalaika’s story yesterday about problems with editors reminds me of this one.
ReplyDeleteMy submission had CZECH AIRLINE as a fill. The assistant editor (not the Times) rejected this because she said it looked made up. I replied it’s not made up, it’s the actual name. Doesn’t matter, she said, it looks made up. There’s more.
Part of the clue was Vaclav Havel Airport. This was also rejected because she never heard of him. I understand generational differences but things don’t have to be contemporaneous to be part of history.
Any more stories like this? Let’s make a list!
Isn't it fun watching the GRAYing of Rex Parker? A decade or so ago he was all about how the puzzle needed more contemporary pop culture in its content. Now he's beginning to slide into "kids these days" mode (though still playing for currency by insisting that it has to be NooB). Fascinating.
ReplyDeleteAs for 1A, I'm not even up to date on my slang, let alone my lingo. Back in my time, the word was "NEWBie," so it was easy to go to NEWB. I guess the contemporary thing is to spell things wrong (see mic, lede, lulz, etc., etc.) but that never even occurred to me.
So, the theme. I liked it but it took a long time to get. First, I had WHIS---G, so it had to be a JUG. But I'm aware that there are both whisky and whiskey, so which was it? Neither one would fit, so there was some trickery involved-- but my first idea was to put in WHISk then jump over to the right to grab the Y sitting there, then diagonally down to JUG. Complicated, but it sorta worked (except that 24A now made no sense.
Then came the real problem: Although I too grew up in Wisconsin and heard that polka a lot [Fun fact: when Weird Al Yankovic came along I just assumed he was Frankie's son, but apparently they are not related], I hadn't remembered that, so I was looking for Knishes--and I could get that by going diagonally from the K to the N of MINI, then back to the left for the ISH -- only the KA were where the es should be. I was ready to accept knishka as a Yiddish plural, but I was getting more and more confused. I think it was finally the gimme DONKEY KONG that clued me in.
iNURES before ENURES, and I eVaded putting in anything but the V until I had the crosses for AVOID. I did know DECOCT, though I always think it means to pour a solution out of a flask; I'll probably think that again in another week.
MCJOB is a very common term used to describe the situation of young people who cannot find a good job; see also 'gig economy' and 'precariat.' And it is the New York Times, puzzle, so knowing the Bobst library is fair enough.
Finally, I think Sarah Palin said that she was a HOCKEY MOM, which was kind of like a momma grizzly, in the 2008 presidential debates. Weren't you people paying attention?
@jberg Paying attention to Sarah Palin. LOL.
DeleteCame to say that i found this one very easy despite the "NEWB" for "NOOB" nonsense. Also, that my family always called it Stuffed Derma, not Kishka, so that one took some time to parse. Otherwise, the KEYS came fast and easy and I was left wishing it had some more teeth, especially after the uncharacteristically simple Wednesday puzzle.
ReplyDeleteRex is too polite to say this, but I'm not. This mess was artificially toughened up with a farrago of mistakes that any competent copyeditor would have caught first time around. Inexcusable.
ReplyDeleteI'm with @Son Volt 8:02, seeing the TURN of the KEY early at WHISKEY JUG x OKEY DOKE, which then quickly solved the puzzle of the HOCKEY MOM and MONKEY PAW (great entry!). Thanks to crossword symmetry, it wasn't hard to place the remaining KEYS. So, a quick and enjoyable Thursday. I liked the pirates' YOHO crossing their BOOTY.
ReplyDeleteDo-overs: another Noob, grin. No idea: EBOY, KISHKA. Help from previous puzzles: MCJOB.
It's interesting what sort of slang sets different people's teeth on edge. I see here that at least three different people today talk of their intense dislike of MCJOB: @Bunny R; @Southside Johnny and @Phillyrad1999.
ReplyDeleteI love the coinage MCJOB. I find it an imaginative and expressive word that cleverly combines two concepts. 1)The fact that McDonald's jobs are so soul-numbingly boring. And 2) That everything on their menu is called a "Mc-something-or-other". I think it's a colorful addition to the language.
What I hate is slang that's lazy, invented solely for texting purposes, and often deliberately misspelled. From yesterday's and today's puzzles alone, a list of [so-called] "words" I despise:
VACAY
PEEPS
NOOB or NEWB
And if I had any idea what it was, I would hate EBOY too.
Right there with you on the lazy language, @Namcy. I was raised to speak properly, taught grammar at each educational level by sticklers, can still diagram any sentence (is that even taught any more?) and find truncated slang and God forbid “text speak” abhorrent. So sue me, I’m old.
DeleteAnd intolerant!
Delete@cdilly52 1030am
DeleteLMS is gunna do wwWWWWAAAAYYYyyy more than sue you. loren ?
In response to What? (9:33 AM) I would say it is not important if the editor is unfamiliar with something, it's what the editor believes the solvers will react to a puzzle. I guess that's one of the reasons for having test solvers.
ReplyDeleteI try to avoid talking about Ross's creations (or, in this case, co-creation). I know he will jam into a puzzle hip references I don't give a crap about, rely on obscure (to me) PPP (of which there is an excessive amount - obscure or not), include off color entries (which will offend some) and annoy me in other ways. Did I say I don't care for his puzzles? As long as they don't appear too frequently, I understand those that like his style deserve their preferences, but from reading the comments here I'm not sure how universally liked his style is.
Am I too negative? Maybe. But for me, this puzzle was not enthralling. Even with a very good theme. Too bad.
This whole week has seemed frustrating to me. I didn't love much of the cluing here, and then I put KEY in as a rebus at first and wasted time on that. I don't know if it's post-ACPT blues, but I feel the puzzles this week have been pretty lousy.
ReplyDeleteFinally, the old song "Who Stole The Kishka (from the butcher shop)" comes in handy!
ReplyDelete@Mike in Bed Sty: "Older folks will get KANE, younger folks will get MCJOB."
ReplyDeleteWrong, Mike. I'm old and I knew MCJOB but didn't know KANE. It's not entirely a generational thing: If you have no abiding interest in "Batman" or in similar PEEPS, you're not going to know a creator of a superhero from any era.
Well said, @Shirley F. Couldn't agree with you more.
@jberg: Guilty as charged. I'd forgotten all about Sarah Palin. And quite happily so, to tell the truth.
Also, @jberg: Don't you mean DECANT?
Had NooB; have seen NEWB, tho.
ReplyDeleteEx HOCKEY dad here; daughter-in-law is a bonafide ringette MOM.
Don't DOUBT, AVOID your worries; everything's going to be alright! This sweet kid has a BEAM and a song that will make your day! 😊
–––
td pg: 22:08 / W: 4* (wrong guess at 3)
Peace 🙏 🇺🇦 ~ Compassion ~ Tolerance ~ Kindness to all 🕊
Well, I tried to rebus MONKEY PAW every which way to make both the production company and HOCKEY MOM work because, unlike the WHISKEY JUG/OKEY DOKE crossing, I was 100% certain of both those answers. Then I wanted WHISKEY Jar because of the song (“Whiskey in a Jar”) so the entire top half just sat there, (Jeopardy theme song running . . . as I go make coffee, get the paper-the “paper paper” feed my cat Pip (sister of the dearly departed avatar cat OC), drink coffee and AHA!!! Got it. So, I spent twice as long being flummoxed as I did solving the messed up top half and the entire south half.
ReplyDeleteWanted fIats for DICTA for a hot second, on top thought UNIONIze and inOt for TKOD because I didn't read the clue correctly (haste makes waste and all), but really one I figured out the KEY, fairly easy.
All in all, I enjoyed this tricksy little theme because I fell for some misdirects, completely stepped in the “hmm, Thursday, must be a rebus” sneakery, and thought this a thoroughly enjoyable puzzle. Cheers (with a KETEL 🍸) to the ever so clever Lucy and Ross.
I have seen "newb" in video game chats, but this was horrible. Firstly, it being Thursday, I assumed there would be a rebus. This of course gave me extra letters which I didn't know what to do with. As far as rotating the direction of the letters (unless it's simply writing backwards in the Downs but cluing "up" in some fashion. Once again, this is not part of the rules of crosswords. One letter per space and English is read from left to right, not at 90 degree angles. I'm really getting sick of these attempts at novel construction at the expense of good, solid content.
ReplyDeleteI overcomplicated this one. First I was sure it had to be OKEEDOKE. Then my 'AHA' moment confirmed there'd be a rebus 'KEY' to make the downs work, and that the trick for the acrosses had something to do with putting a key in a key hole (so the acrosses had K(KEY)Y. Chimes wouldn't ring, couldn't find any errors, and finally replaced the rebuses (rebusi?) with E.
ReplyDeleteNo problem with NEWB, wrote it in as the word rhyming with, well, tube let's say. Agree BEAM's a noun, but it's inferable (Mom was beaming, I guess with a beam on her face). Also agree imposter syndrome feeling is much more about self-doubt, but every time I pose as a decent crossword solver I quicky learn that's doubtable, so OK.
Feels like I struggled just the right amount for a Thursday, and enjoyed the puzzle.
Homage to Ukraine
ReplyDeleteAnd Kishka
кишка
Really nice puzzle, albeit quite difficult for me. 10D has three plausible answers:
ReplyDeleteComanches
Cheyennes
Cherokees
Got it on the second try. Concoct is oddly familiar. Newb v. Noob - both are correct. The gimmick was easy to see once I filled in 'turnkeys'.
Newb. Just sound it out: new-biie. Strange and sometimes just incorrect clueing. My blog comment yesterday DID mention the comma coincidence, but was censored out by a moderator. I foolishly thought that this was a blog for crossword puzzle solvers and all other puzzles were irrelevant. Silly me.
ReplyDeleteNEWB makes more sense to me than NOOB, and Merriam-Webster agrees: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/newb
ReplyDeleteFelt easy for a Thursday. The theme was a bit too cute, IMHO.
ReplyDeleteI knew the key had to turn early on, but I thought it was turning inside a rebus for a bit. When I saw the solution I was pleased at how well it worked, and enjoyed the rest of the puzzle. Then I got to the NW corner.
ReplyDeleteIf only I had known the lion.
I thought maybe the menial was a MCcOg. Count me in with the “BEAM doesn't fit the clue” crowd. But grin didn't fit OHARE. And although traffic can be calMED, I was suspicious of signals, but tiMED didn't work. Ugh.
NEWB slowed me down, and LGBq was an error for me.
KISHKAS? I’m not very familiar with polka music, but I did love to whirl around the gym doing the polka back in high school P.E.
Before I had the theme I wanted ROBOT bITS and I still like it better.
Give me wittily clued commonly familiar words instead of current trivia junk to make the puzzle accessible to NOOBS.
A good concept, although it didn’t really jump out at me. I had to study for a bit in order to ABSORB it but I see now that the down answer TURNs at the KEY entry. So hurray for a good a Thursday theme.
ReplyDeleteOther stuff though was just oddly off. Starting of course with 1A which I won’t go into since others already have. This was one of those days when I felt DOUBT about whether I was judging fairly so I read the comments first. I didn’t see where anyone else mentioned it but I thoroughly detested the plural CHEYENNE with an S because it’s one of the Native American tribes almost exclusively referred to in the singular and plural the same: The Arapahoe, Sioux, Osage, Crow, Kiowa and the Pawnee to name a few.
Loved the clue for EEK, made me BEAM big smile. Notice I didn’t say smile a big BEAM because that doesn’t work and neither did the clue for 13 down. JOSTLE for JOCKEY was my only stumble. Otherwise this was pretty uneventful.
@Southside
ReplyDeleteJust because you've never heard of MCJOB, doesn't mean it's "made up."
Nice to read a blog like this one. Just read yesterday’s. To criticize obscure answers is one thing but to suggest that RCA, CANARD, NEA, REAIR, are somehow “unfair” is quite another. Although I usually have no idea what the answers to clues about Grammy winners, HipHop artists and the like are, I don’t consider such as unfair simply because of my ignorance.
ReplyDeleteNo problemo with this Thursday. I only briefly considered a rebus and quite enjoyed the TURNed KEYs. NYU was a gimme since I did three years there and walked past the Bobst regularly. KISHKA and knish go together as a NYC phrase although I always opted for the knish. Finally a clue for OREOS that made me pause for a moment. Thank you! I vastly prefer NEWB to noob so I started out on the right foot and stepped right down to WHISKEYJUG. Rex is just wrong on noob. Even my phone wants to autocorrect it. MURMUR is a lovely word. I’m relaxed just thinking about it.
ReplyDeleteMy tiny nits: I’ve never heard of MCJOB but as a MC myself I don’t think I’ll use it. It’s clever but I’m not keen on the menial part. Grrr. It’s en pointe, never ONTOE. That’s fingernails on blackboard to me. Please don’t do that again.
didn't start off on the right foot: brown JUG, sans LITTLE, naturally.
ReplyDeletegot the KEY thingee mostly right at JOCKEY FOR and TURKEY DAY, but not enough to satisfy.
@Mike in Bed-Stuy - Don't you mean "its we Boomers"? You should be ashamed. Really, I should be, I made and exception just to let you know one shouldn't correct another's grammar in public.
ReplyDeleteOkay…. For any of you in New York who just discovered Kishka, do yourself a favor and go to a deli and try it. While not particularly healthy, it is soooo delicious.
ReplyDelete@Gary Jugert 9:15 said:
ReplyDelete“Finally, people wearing sunglasses in their profile pictures, ehem Ross... go ahead and take them off while they take your photo. It's not that bright right now and it's never been a "cool" look even for rock stars, and you're not a rock star.”
Here is one problem with making gratuitous nasty remarks: for all you know, Ross Trudeau is wearing sun glasses because his neurofibromatosis or one of the many surgeries he has had has made the necessary to protect his eyes. the world would be a better place if people would not make negative personal remarks about others.
Surprised by all the disdain for NEWB. That’s always been my preferred short form of “newbie” and I only grudgingly switch to NOOB for crossword-solving purposes. So that got me off on the right foot. Seemed a bit heavy on the slangy jargon, especially the top row, but I guess my brain was just in that mode today. I also liked the revealer, so all in all, a pretty smooth solve for me.
ReplyDeleteThanks to the McDonaldization of America, you can work at a McJob and live in a McMansion. You can be a McChristian, go to. McChurch, sleep in a McBed, and eat a McBreakfast. The list of McWords goes on and on to describe the quick, cheap, and superficial versions of reality that have crept into our culture since those famous fries were first dropped into a vat of canola-blend oil decades ago.
ReplyDeleteAs for the puzzle, this was for me something of a McThursday experience with too much trivia crammed into a puzzle that would have otherwise been fun thanks to the creative theme that was waiting to be set free.
The Cherokee (I'm a tribal member) are not Great Plains natives. Their ancestral home was in what is now the Southeastern U.S. They were forcibly relocated to the northeastern part of present-day Oklahoma, with most settling in the Ozark foothills, even though their territory stretched from the Arkansas border west to the Great Plains region of the state. The Plains Indians roamed this area, and the Cherokee avoided settling there.
ReplyDeleteMy own Cherokee ancestors voluntarily relocated to what was then Arkansas Territory (in present-day Oklahoma, prior to the creation of Indian Territory) a year before the forced removal on the Trail of Tears. There was a program, little-known today, established in 1824 that encouraged voluntary relocation.
On another note, I plopped in NEWB without hesitation, as that's how we spelled it 30+ years ago, as a shortened version of NEWBIE, where I worked. Any newcomer was called a NEWBIE, or sometimes, NEWB.
Also put in HAY immediately, as I reasoned if it was the car, mustang would have been capitalized.
no, no, no to UNIONISTS, as clued the answer is UNIONIzed. why? unionists are those who favor unions, say Democrat legislators or organizers. but the clue is explicit: 17A: Organized workers. these are those who ARE UNIONIzed like Amazon, in one locale.
ReplyDeletewhere I came from, it's OKEY DOKEy. always has been, always will be.
I did not BEAM with joy. It all DECOCTs to this: How else is a ballet performed if not ON TOE?
ReplyDeleteI always thought your BOOTY was that big thing you sit on. And hells bells, I've been writing it: OKEY DOKEY since before JADA rolled her eye.
Oh...the TURN KEYS were not especially hard to get. I got it at the WHIS[KEY] JUG. HOCKEY MOM (I confess), did make me smile. I also will begin counting the ways we clue OREOS. That was cool frijoles.
Everything else felt a bit like YO HO ho hum, pull a rabbit out of the hat trick.
Hey MicKEY....be sure and eat your KISHKA. Dad's already into the KETEL.
I guess that OFL has never been in love. To MURMUR Sweet Nothings in one's devoted's ear is centuries, if not millennia, olde.
ReplyDeleteWhen I saw the clue for 6D, Stuffed Jewish dish, my first thought was "Has my zaftig Cousin Estelle made it into the grid?" But of course it was kishka, one of those Jewish foods that is accompanied by a cardiologist referral. Cholent is another one, which I don't recall ever seeing in a puzzle. Both are delicious but should only be eaten every 15 years or so.
ReplyDelete😂😂😂
DeleteGot a late start on my “puzzling” today but I absolutely loved this puzzle and figured out the gimmick quickly with a momentary single box rebus of KEY under WHIS_JUG.
ReplyDelete@Southside, all words were “made up” at one time or another.
@Pabloinnh, I felt the same way you did about NEWB then @Zed and @Peter P enlightened me on what NOOB really means. D’oh on my part for getting the NEWB that is also a BOOB thing.
@Nancy/jberg…we can only hope that the NEXT time we hear about Sarah Palin is when she loses the gigantic group of candidates vying for the ONE congressional district in Alaska. Santa Claus (real legal name) is in this group. Apparently Palin hasn’t lived in Alaska for around 10 years.
From a Supreme Court decision on Noob v. Newb*:
ReplyDeleteA belly full of high-dollar wine
A fat hand, a fat wallet too
Things change and get strange
With this movement of time
It's happening right now to you
From Wikipedia:
"Newbie, newb, noob, n00b or nub is a slang term for a novice or newcomer, or somebody inexperienced in a profession or activity. Contemporary use can particularly refer to a beginner or new user of computers, often concerning Internet activity, such as online gaming[1] or Linux use.[2][3]
The origin of this term is uncertain. Earliest uses probably date to late twentieth century United States Armed Forces jargon, though possible precursor terms are much earlier. Variant forms of the noun include newby and newbie, while the related term noob (often stylized as "n00b") is often used in online gaming."
*Or lyrics from the Avett Brothers, Down With The Shine. I can't remember.
Really liked this 🧩.
ReplyDeleteNot sure about beam and murmur, 🦖. Beam can be a noun I think… as sunbeam. Hmmm maybe not …we don’t say a beam of light or do we? Ok don’t know about that one..
Murmur - the sound of it it is comforting/soothing (to me) like a purr. And I did read somewhere that people are comforted by whispering… same as murmur maybe.
🤗 Just a little counterpoint to today’s 🎯critique. 🤗
Anyway!
The 🔑 🔐 to this one was 🔑.
🤗🦖🦖🦖🦖🦖🤗
At first I gave this the stinKEYe. But then I thought about all the BucKEYe and HawKEYe flunKEY types in the Great Plains. What would they say? I finally decided that they’d think that all of this malarKEY is just hoKEYness.
ReplyDeleteI’ve opined before that virtually 100% of the time, comments that amount to “the ignorant, lazy editors got this clue/answer wrong” are themselves wrong. I’d explain how crosswords work, and why the answer isn’t always the first entry in the M-W, and why the answer isn’t necessarily in the M-W at all. But I and others have tried to explain this many times, to no effect. But I would say that today’s blog and comments are chock full of this sort of complaint and I disagree with each of them.
BTW @ JC66, I know that you know this, but @Southside Johnny uses the term “made up word” when he means “word with which I’m unfamiliar”. I have never found myself agreeing with him on any of these words, or agreeing with his apparent belief that the NYT is manufacturing words. Constructors, not editors, fill the grids.
Rant over.
I enjoyed this puzzle a lot, and didn’t find it difficult for a Thursday. The theme concept was great, as it led many of us to think “rebus” for at least a while, until such thinking became obviously wrong. Thanks for a nice time, Lucy Howard and Ross Trudeau.
Had Radiokits then Rocketkits (with non starters being CTEAM, which made sense) before landing on Robotkits.
ReplyDeleteThought MCJOB was a gig as Masters of Ceremony and hooBoy, EBOY!
Took me longer than usual but in general, it was fun.
Ok with NEWB (though like everyone had NOOB), But how can it not be TKOED?
"Kishka" classic polka song - "Who Stole the Kishka" by Frankie Yankovich and others.
ReplyDelete@egs
ReplyDeleteOh, I sure hope you're right about @Southside.
♪ The murmur of a brook at eventide
ReplyDeleteThat ripples by a nook where two lovers hide ♪
An easy 1d for me: the Bobst Library was brand new when I attended NYU. "I have to go to Bobst now." "Okay, I'll be at Tisch." (Tisch School of the Arts.) "Cool. Meet me later at Loeb." (Loeb Student Center.) "Then we'll buy drugs in Washington Square Park." (Just kidding.)
••••••
Sidebar: it turns out that Elmer Holmes Bobst (rhymes with "Survivor" host Jeff Probst) was palsy-walsy with Nixon and quite anti-Semitic — rather ironic considering NYU's high percentage of Jewish students. I don't think any of us were aware of that at the time. But apparently in 2016 student organizations started petitioning the school to change the library's name.
••••••
So maybe I'm all alone here, but: This Theme Does Not Work. If you merely *turn* each KEY 90° you cover up three letters in the down answer. Well, two letters since the middle letter is always E. But, MONEPAW becomes MOKEYAW. TUREDAY becomes TUKEYAY.
You have to *squish* the KEY into a single square as you *turn* it, in order to make the premise work. The revealer answer should be SQUISH&TURNKEYS.
Not to mention that people frequently say OKEY-DOKEY, which contains a second KEY that could have been capitalized on. Instead, it's conspicuous by its absence here.
Annnd — I also don't like having those four 9-letter answers that are not part of the theme.
Can't believe this got a Pow! from Jeff C. But I will say this in the puzzle's favor: NEWB is correct.
Forty black squares kind of cast a dark GRAY shadow over this puzzle before I even got started. I guess all those Ks and Ys were challenging to fit into the grid. Also needed some help from convenient plurals (POCs) including one of the most notorious two for one POCs in xword history at the end of 12D OREO and 26A EPEE. A caricature of convenient crosswordese if I ever did see one.
ReplyDeleteSurprised to see repeats of a sort at 4D BOOTY and 55D ASS.
There was way too much trivia and proper nouns JAMMED into this one for me to even try to finish.
ReplyDeletetry googling "newb" vs "noob"
ReplyDelete@pmdm (10:09) My sentiments exactly. I cringed when I saw RT’s name this morning.
@Nancy (10:23) Don’t get too comfy (Is that a “lazy” word?) in the former unsuccessful VP candidate’s absence. She recently emerged from the Alaskan winter and announced a run for a vacant congressional seat. She’s one among 50 who have done so but not surprisingly, her candidacy was immediately blessed by the infamous former POTUS as one of his exclusive chosen few. If only he would go into hibernation.
@Canon (10:52) I noticed your post yesterday and was not surprised to see it deleted. Comments with spoilers about other puzzles such as Wordle and Spelling Bee on the day they run are generally verboten.
Not making a list but it appears that several solvers fell a little short of fully understanding the theme.
ReplyDeleteAlso a LOT of folks are trying to outRex Rex. I can't recall a blog so filled with petty, whiny, complaints.
EON is an SOC(singular of convenience). It was used to avoid having EONSKANE CROSSING SSTU.
ReplyDelete
ReplyDeleteI like this definition (sounds like a lot of people on this blog) -
NOOB - Also spelled n00b (with zeros), this is actually a derogatory term saved for arrogant yet ignorant know-it-alls, who make fools of themselves by spreading negativity, making erroneous claims, and just being all-around unpleasant individuals.
Medium. I went with a rebus at first until I hit the reveal and things became clear. Very clever, liked it. That said, NEWB (me too for NooB) and TKOD across the top did not initially bode well for this one.
ReplyDeleteUgh the cluing left much to be desired! I also hated the "soothing" clue for murmur. A murmur is not necessarily soothing. It can be, but it can also be annoying or even icky. That clue makes no sense. I also didn't like robot kits. Seems totally random. And I also have never heard of that Jewish dish. The theme was ok. I liked donkey kong.
ReplyDeleteThe NEWB,noob,newbie ngram.
ReplyDeleteMW sources NEWB to the early 1980’s and noob to the early 1990’s. Of course, both NGrams and MW are sourcing from written works and slang is usually coined through spoken word, so both terms are probably older than the sources say.
@Peter P - That’s how I remember it, too, but I think today the “boob” connotation has largely disappeared from “noob.” Maybe it still exists in certain contexts, but just look at the comments today and it would certainly seem that the two spellings are understood to be equivalent.
@JD - I’m pretty sure the country would be better off if the Avett brothers replaced five SC Justices. 😉
@Beezer - all words were “made up” at one time or another. !!!!!
@egsforbreakfast - paragraph two - Yep. I’m half Dutch with a heavy dose of Spanish from my mom so tilting at windmills is genetic here.
@Legume 11:38 - 👍🏽 - Exactly.
@Anon 11:24 - I deleted a similar rant from my first post. See @egsforbreakfast’s second paragraph.
@Tale Told - Sure, but couldn’t you have just written, “it’s medical not fashion so what you wrote looks insensitive”? The snapback seems a little harsh, although your advice about assumptions is good.
PPP Observation
If you’ve been around you can probably write this for me and can just skip this
Pop Culture, Product names, and other Proper nouns are inherently exclusionary. The only difference between a Taming of the Shrew reference and a 10 Things I Hate About You reference is who is being excluded. Same with Lil Nas X versus Abba versus Elvis versus Puccini. There is going to be PPP in a crossword, it is going to be somewhere between 20% and 40% of the answer/clues in a NYTX (and probably elsewhere but I don’t ever check elsewhere). Occasionally a solver will be happy to see their favorite pop culture thing appear. But more often it’s just a group of letters to suss out and the solver is busy hoping it’s not some randomly spelt name they have never heard of. PPP is always lower quality than wordplay.
And, no, there’s not more of it than there used to be. If you are noticing it it is probably because it’s unfamiliar. The familiar PPP just seems normal as you solve. I learned this from personal experience.
I don’t care what the dictionary says. Decoct is not a word.
ReplyDeletePuz left m&e a bit keyed-up. But, hey -- it' a ThursPuz, sooo … ok.
ReplyDeletestaff weeject pick KEY. It was key to the puztheme. Show of Respect for the lil wordlets.
The Jaws of Themelessness make a cross-over guest appearance. Nice bonus.
faves: FLOWN. MURMUR. KETO & KETEL. BTEAM & BEAM. ABSORB. CHEYENNES. KISHKA. HAY.
The fillins never quite got full-out Ow de Sperational, but they flirted with it some. Notable inroads: TKOD. NEWB [Better clue: {A fresh bottle opener??} ]. EBOY. DECOCT.
Thanx for gangin up on us, Lucy H & Ross T. folks. It was a MOVIN display of constructioneerin.
Masked & Anonymo6Us
**gruntz**
I had GLASS JAR and MASON JAR before I figured out that KEY was the magic word for solving the puzzle, but still was stuck because like any drinker worth their salt, moonshine comes in a JAR, not a jug.
ReplyDeleteThe point of the sunglasses photo seems to be that the lenses reflect a crossword grid. Actually two different grids, it looks like.
ReplyDeleteDon't think anyone's pointed it out yet, but it's quite neat that the answer to the Jordan Peele clue has, prominently featured via the theme, his former comedy partner KEY!
ReplyDeleteI agree in general with ShirleyF 7:33 am but do not see why she would call hockeymom and sego borderline ppp. They seem like perfectly normal words. The MIAA on the other hand is definitely ppp to me. I dont even bother trying to get those ridiculous references to teams. I just cheat and move on. Where did someone get the idea that most cross word puzzlers are rabid sports fans.?
ReplyDeleteI have a dim memory of being served KISHKA at my m-in-l long long ago. A kind of sausagy thing filled with flour and fat and onion? I just looked at some recipes online and it really didn't look appetizing. I suppose those so inclined might serve it next week at their Seder. Only with matzo flour instead.
ReplyDeletepg in half an hour but the p in 3 seconds!
First impressions.
ReplyDeleteDecoct brought to mind John and Lorena Bobbitt.
This was one of my fastest Thursday times in recent memory .... until I finished and didn't get the congratulatory message. I took a screen shot of my completed puzzle so I could try and figure out the mistake without the clock running. It's amazing how that little ticking clock really stresses me out sometimes 😂😂. I finally figured out my error: the intersection of 1-Down (Sch. with the Elmer Holmes Bobst Library) and 14-Across (Words sung twice before "a pirate's life for me."). I had HOHO as my answer, which meant I had NHU for my 1-Down answer. New Hampshire University, I thought, sure, why not? I've heard the expression "Yo ho ho and a bottle of rum" in reference to pirate lingo, but never just Yo Ho; that seems wrong to me.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, other than that, this was a very easy solve. The gimmick revealed itself fairly quickly and after that I just looked for all the Across answers that had KEY inside them and knew the intersecting Down answers would use that key to turn a wrong answer into a right one. Easy!
I've only ever seen NEWB spelled with an E and a W (since it's an abbreviation of the original slang, NEWBIE), so 1-Across was simple. Do people really use NOOB? Not in my experience ...
ReplyDeleteTerrible terrible cluing. I came up with some of the words, like ABSORB--but said, Nah, that can't be right. And DOUBT when the answer clearly pointed to some specific that shrinks and those who go to shrinks know about, and then throw it in there without the SELF? Robot Kits? Please. Has anyone every heard the word: UNIONISTS? The NYT of late has written about unions (Amazon, Starbucks) but use the word UNIONISTS? Please.
ReplyDeleteShortz was short on thinking this puzzle through today.
Can someone explain the cluing on ABSORB?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDelete@ChE Dave
ReplyDeleteABSORB = Learn (Successfully study).
@Photomatte…I get your pirate lament but somehow in the back of my mind (I don’t know why), I thought of “Yo ho ho, and a bottle of rum” (in a musical tone). Honestly, at this point I forget how it was clued but I think I agree with you even though I “got it.”
ReplyDeleteHa! Should have paid more attention to the revealer. Was sure this was a rebus Thursday.
ReplyDeleteInstead of "turning" the key, I "inserted" the key. Looked good, but didn't give the happy sound.
My parents, who were German Jews, never ate kishka, because it was Eastern European in origin. However, they often used the word which is slang for "guts"...as in "the ball hit me in the kishkas."
ReplyDeleteLike most Yiddish words, it's just the best.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteABSORB as in soak up as in the dictionary:
ReplyDeletetake in and understand fully (information, ideas, or experience)
TURNKEY, love that word and its the revealer!
ReplyDeleteNooB (most common) NEWB (how I always want to spell it because newbie was new when I learned it). Rook roob would do OK.
OKEY OKie OKEe OaKie.
DOKE DOak.
No idea how to spell anyofit. And the phrase is often used as DOKEY with any of the variations. All possible because of the rebus or turnkey or whatever pixie dust the puzzle might use.
So many great answers. Even wondering if peeps would include a KEYSTONE PA of which I am one. Soccer moms don't drive to rinks. Famous HOCKEY MOM just now in the news. What more could you want, or not want for that matter. You can put lipstick on a pig's stomach and its still not a Kosher KISHKA.
TKOD works perfectly.
Peeps is FAM too or at least can be.
The good stuff plus the kinky rebusish theme gives this a plus
Wasn’t that hard to solve and I got the theme pretty quickly, BUT, I never quite figure out how to enter the REBUS answers correctly. Wasted lots of time once I had it solved by entering KEY, then E/Key, before realizing it wasn’t a REBUS at all, though I really, really wanted it to be. I’ve had this problem before when using the app, which is not as forgiving as my old standby print edition which doesn’t care if put all the letters in one box, use a slash or just nod sagely and tell myself I’ve solved it.
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ReplyDeleteHo ho - a one-(two?)-letter DNF in the silliest place - EBBS. All that after I got the key to the answers. ah me
ReplyDeleteDon't get caught in the "NET" I made. ;-)
Diana, Lady-in-Waiting for Crosswords
Any more, when I see the name Ross Trudeau, I groan. He just slaps any old thing in there and then somehow finds a way to justify it. Example: TKOD.
ReplyDeleteThis one played more medium for me; befuddled in the NW I went to the NE and wound up with MONEPAW (?) with every cross pretty solidly confirmed. Then my eye just happened to hit on that crossing -KEY- and in a flash 9-down now made sense. Here I must agree that finding the mcguffin on your own beats, hands down, looking up the revealer, for the overall solving experience. But that's the only plus in a sea of minuses (minusi?).
If you're going to pick a bleedover, MUST you pick BTEAM?? That's bad enough the first time!
NOBODY who didn't attend NHU is going to know the Elmer...anyway, that library--or even who he is/was. Plus--while we're in the NW--wouldn't you think those two words at 14 across would rhyme with "...me?" SO, HeHe? No. Much time lost there. And boy, that clue for DOUBT! Gotta be kidding.
The lovely--and extremely tire-savvy--Marisa TOMEI is DOD, but it's a bogey anyway.
Not so at Wordlegusta National:
BGBBY
GGGGG!
AVOID MOVIN’
ReplyDeleteThe HOCKEYMOM seems OKEYDOKE,
no DOUBT the JOCKEYFOR the TEAM,
but she’ll ABSORB a KETEL-Coke
and a WHISKEYJUG of Jim BEAM.
--- ENOS O’HARE
Not bad. But I would have clued the reveal differently. Operations that are ready-to-go or a hint to unlocking the four answers in this puzzle
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