Relative difficulty: Challenging (***for a Tuesday***) (names names names)
Theme answers:
- NELLY SACHS (17A: 1966 Swedish Literature Nobelist who wrote about the struggles of the Jewish people)
- GERTRUDE ELION (23A: 1988 American Nobelist in Physiology or Medicine who helped develop the first drug used to fight rejection in organ transplants)
- DONNA STRICKLAND (38A: 2018 Canadian Physics Nobelist who helped implement chirped pulse amplification)
- BETTY WILLIAMS (51A: 1976 Peace Nobelist from Northern Ireland who co-founded Community of Peace People)
- MARIE CURIE (60A: 1911 Polish/French Chemistry Nobelist who pioneered research in radioactivity)
Nelly Sachs (German pronunciation: [ˈnɛliː zaks]; 10 December 1891 – 12 May 1970) was a German-Swedish poet and playwright. Her experiences resulting from the rise of the Nazis in World War II Europe transformed her into a poignant spokesperson for the grief and yearnings of her fellow Jews. Her best-known play is Eli: Ein Mysterienspiel vom Leiden Israels (1950); other works include the poems "Zeichen im Sand" (1962), "Verzauberung" (1970), and the collections of poetry In den Wohnungen des Todes (1947), Flucht und Verwandlung (1959), Fahrt ins Staublose (1961), and Suche nach Lebenden(1971). She was awarded the Nobel Prize in Literature in 1966. (wikipedia)
• • •
[In honor of Alfred Nobel, here are some more Swedes concerned with winning]
I hope none of the names created Naticks for any of you. The crosses all seem fair to me, but I can see novices and younger people having trouble with, for instance, the precise spelling of MERCK and ENOKI—the "E" and the "I" in those words, respectively are not very inferable if you don't know the names. And if you don't, my guess is that you are also unlikely to know GERTRUDE ELION (I sure didn't). So, tough luck. But if you are a regular solver, there should've been no trouble there, or anywhere else that I can see. I assume most everyone knows what a BENTO box is by now, but even if you don't, BETTY seems like the best guess for a woman's name, so you should be OK. I confess that I failed this trivia test utterly. I knew MARIE CURIE, of course, but none of the others even rang a bell. The science Nobelist names I don't feel too bad about, but as a literature professor I'm at least slightly embarrassed not to have known NELLY SACHS. I don't teach Swedish literature, or 20th-century literature, it's true, but still, she seems rather important, and I'm glad to learn about her today, so the puzzle did provide me instruction, if not entertainment. There's not much interest in the grid outside the names, primarily because there are no answers longer than six letters, and only two of those (HITMAKER, EMISSARY). The only thing that made me screw up my face in resistance was AIR ARM (47D: Military aviation wing). I guess this is just a general name for what the Air Force is in this country—that is, the part of the military concerned with flight. OK. I can accept that. It's not thrilling, but it's valid. I wish more of this had been thrilling, or at least seemed like it was having a good time and wanted us to join in. Tributes don't have to be humorless exercises in fact dissemination.
ReplyDeleteI solved without reading the clues for the long acrosses. Like OFL, the only name I was familiar with was Mme. Curie. But everything fell into place nicely, except that I thought the organ transplant woman at 23A might be GERTRUDE E. LION.
@Rex was pretty rough today. May I suggest reading the comments of the constructor, Mary Lou Guizzo HERE
ReplyDelete@offthegrid Thanks for the link. Sometimes Rex is a little dense
Deletehttps://youtu.be/pHlSE9j5FGY
ReplyDeleteA puzzle by a woman to celebrate women is fine by me, but when the result is so dull it's not.
Zero pep and absolutely no pleasure in solving this.
A collaboration between MLG and JOHNX would have definitely spiced things up.
Well I liked this a lot. I enjoyed it immensely. Even if the theme didn't have "cossword value", whatever the F*** that is. Hello, Mary Lou and thank you.
ReplyDeleteGreat puzzle and a gold mine of Wordle starters.
ReplyDeleteTotally agree with Rex. Outside of the names, the puzzle played like a Monday. The theme was just so... dull.
ReplyDeleteVery careless dnf in the SW when I fell for a kealoa at 65A, entering TIEd instead of TIER for the clue "Level," then failed to notice that TSAdS was a t-bad answer for "Bygone Russian rulers.
ReplyDeleteFor me, the lack of sparkle in this grid was the result of trying to produce a Tuesday level puzzle with long theme answers that are not, for the most part, well known names. So the crosses had to be very straightforward. I'll take the blandness for the tribute to these Nobelists on this day.
Quick Hidden Diagonal Word (HDW) clue & answer:
Crow's hallos?
Answer:
CAWS (begins with the C in 43A and moves diagonally towards the SW)
In a post-solve reading about IWD, I learned that on March 8, 1917, in Petrograd, Russia, women textile workers, despite orders to the contrary, left their jobs and demonstrated for “Bread and Peace” – protesting food shortages, czarism, and demanding an end to World War I. This led to a mass strike and widespread protest. Seven days later, Tsar Nicholas II resigned and the provisional government granted women the right to vote.
ReplyDeleteDare I dream about an encore in the present?
Show of hands for anyone who keeps up with the world of chirped pulse amplification.
ReplyDeleteI mean, seriously: the only way into this puzzle is to start with Marie Curie, and the ride the ludicrously easy, pedestrian, crosswordese fill all the way back to the top. Opposite of SSW? Former Russian leaders? Mama bears? ARC? CRUISE? and on and on and on. It felt like the world’s easiest diagramless: answer a series of trivially simple standalone questions to reveal a list of names you’ve never heard.
Yes, it’s great to honor remarkable women who have won Nobels. Many in traditionally male-dominated fields. But honor them by telling their stories to people who (like me) don’t know them, not by asking me to name them. I’m sure there are all sorts of lists of greats in fields most of us don’t follow: Russian cosmonauts after Gagarin, Aussie Rules footballers, Surfing champions, deep sea explorers not named Cousteau . . . Why pretend we should know them, and then strap on our training wheels when we don’t.
Tributes don't have to be humorless exercises in fact dissemination
ReplyDeleteBeing humorless is the perfect tribute to women, followed by Olympic mud wrestling and self-parking car fiascos.
What I liked about this puzzle, was that the unfamiliar names (like Rex, all but Marie Curie - though Donna Strickland rang some kind of bell) were easy enough to get by the downs and gave me some important women to look up on IWD. And got the Wordle in 4 this morning, so all in all a solid start to the day!
ReplyDeleteThe names were irrelevant to the puzzle, they were a set of patronizing female Novel Prize Winners, not a theme or honorific, just a construction.
ReplyDeleteThey might as well been gibberish to the myriad of NYT solvers, but it just sings virtue signaling. High Bechdel Score? Check.
Complaints are often made here about words in puzzles that are out of parlance, that hardly anyone knows, and how unfair it is to have them included in the grid.
ReplyDeleteUsually someone responds to say that the word was still gettable because it was crossed fairly, and that it brought about some welcome learning.
Let today’s puzzle – and Mary Lou’s skill – show the wisdom of that response. We’ve already heard from a commenters (including @Rex) that there were theme answers they didn’t know, long answers – one is even a grid spanner – and yet no complaints about their being unknown, about Naticks.
Brava, Mary Lou, in highlighting these accomplished individuals, and in skillfully making a puzzle with so many unknown answers for so many solvers – solvable! And all the more impressive, you did it in an early week puzzle. Thank you for an inspiring theme that was allowed to shine!
Given the day I’m ok with the theme and any knock on effect on the fill. Would love as little help on Rank Below Capt = CDR ??? Anyone? Anyone?
ReplyDeleteShort for Commander, like Commander Riker. Naval ranks.
DeleteGood idea for a theme, poorly executed. I’m sometimes confused when Rex picks at a theme with “why THESE choices”, but today, that’s exactly what I thought.
ReplyDeleteIf they were all the first women to win their respective prizes, that would make sense.
If they were all non-shared awards, that would be much better. Especially, awards not shared with men.
If they included Economics, that would at least be a complete set.
And it would be vastly much better if none of the clues fit more than one person (as the clue for Betty Williams also describes to Mairead Maguire).
Rex has pointed out the possible Natick spots. Two years ago, both ENOKI and BENTO would have been unknowns for me and I know them only from crosswords, so I probably would have missed at least one of those crosses not long ago.
So, according to Rex, whenever we encounter a tribute puzzle, we should ask,"But why...in crossword puzzle form ?" I'm reading your opinion, Rex, by why in a blog form? I'm writing my reaction to the puzzle, but why in English ? Hmmm ?
ReplyDeleteGood to hear from you, @John X.
Yesterday I roasted Rex for an inane comment. Today I compliment him for a brave and well expressed comment.
ReplyDeleteI just pulled up the list of the 58 female Nobel-prize winners. Besides MARIECURIE, the only familiar names were Mother
Teresa and Toni Morrison. That would seem to be one of the purposes of the Nobel, to give recognition to those doing great work in fields which aren't widely publicized.
You nailed it, Rex. Dutiful. Joyless but dutiful. I kept thinking, This is nothing more than a trip to the almanac.
ReplyDelete@Phillyrad1999: CDR = Commander. It's US Navy officer ranks.
ReplyDeleteNothing to add to Rex’s write-up as it echoes my sentiments exactly - although, since it is Tuesday I strapped myself into the cockpit and dutifully slogged my way through cross after cross parsing together something that looked like a plausible first/last name. Was slightly more exciting than watching paint dry.
ReplyDeleteIs the rank below Cpt. (CDR) a commander ? If so, that’s a new one for me. I wanted CPO (Chief Petty Officer ?) but that wouldn’t work - had to rely on crosses and blind faith.
The kicker for me was that until you got to MARIECURIE, all the names had double letters in them, so I thought there was some sort of theme within the theme. And of course the constructor has double letters in her name . . . .
ReplyDeleteit's worth the time to read the constructor notes in Wordplay: women from different countries, working in different fields . . . .
The irony of rex's column today is hat for the longest time he kept on bemoaning the fact that there were very few female constructors, and typically few women's names in the puzzles. Today we have a female constructor who has loaded the puzzle with women of note (even if i didn't know most of them) - - - for most bloggers this would be cause for celebration?
Speaking of BOGEY,Wordle 262 1/6*
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
Medium-challenging? Despite the four unknown names (as it was for most others, MARIE CURIE was a gimme, and DONNA STRICKLAND did ring a bell for some reason, but the other names, no way), the crosses were so easy that this was a personal best Tuesday for me.
ReplyDeleteInteresting puzzle, I only knew MARIE CURIE by name. I was easily able to get MERCK, but mainly because in 2014 my company, the world's leading supplier of chemicals and reagents for the life science field (Sigma-Aldrich, at that time), was acquired by Merck KgAA out of Darmstadt. That's different from the US Merck that you see in pharma commercials. It would have been really cool, but a very deep cut and wouldn't have fit the symmetry, if the constructor had been able to work GERTY CORI into the puzzle, 1947 Nobel winner and intimately involved in the founding of the company. To bring this full circle (stay with me!), her lab needed a bioreagent in sufficient quality and quantity to research with, and one of her lab researchers went to the lead chem engineer at a fledgling company to see if they could make it. He did, and Sigma Chemical was born. The reagent? ATP!
ReplyDeleteIt helps for me that I teach at the same university as Prof. Strickland. So I grinned ear-to-ear when I saw her name. The rest of the puzzle, for me, was quick enough that I didn't notice it; a friend of mine (who also knows Prof. Strickland's full name) set a Tuesday record at 3:03, which I find almost inconceivably fast.
ReplyDeleteDonna Strickland and I went to the same high school in Guelph Ontario. A local hero.
DeleteThx Mary Lou, for a wonderful tribute puz to International Women's Day! :)
ReplyDeleteEasy-med.
Pretty much flew thru this one, despite only knowing one of these remarkable women.
Solved top to bottom, with the exception of the NE, not being able to see the MAKER part of HIT. Also the MERCK / ELION cross gave pause.
A most enjoyable and satisfying adventure.
@jae
You're right, for me, Croce's 687 was on par with a NYT Fri. See you next Mon. :)
___
yd pg 16:47 / W: 3*
Peace 🙏 🇺🇦 ~ Compassion ~ Tolerance ~ Kindness to all 🕊
Three times a week I go to the New Yorker to print out their crossword puzzle and scroll past their Name Drop puzzle. I did it once, it was exactly the experience I expected, and I’ve never been tempted to do it again. It’s always there, it’s the first puzzle, I assume they keep publishing it because people love the trivia, but I always wrinkle my nose at the odiferous whiff of “who cares” as I scroll on by.
ReplyDeleteAnd that is pretty much my reaction to any tribute puzzle. Tribute puzzles are not the lowest form of crossword (quote puzzles are the lowest form), but they are a close second. “Humorless” “piety” is not the way I’d go about celebrating IWD. Want to celebrate women? How about going to the folks over at Inkubator and republish 30 of their best this month? Use your huge platform to promote their much smaller platform that’s actually celebrating women all year long. I guess I’m glad the day is acknowledged, but a PPP phest is not how I would have chosen to do it.
Good thing the crosses on all those names were pretty fair - like most (everyone?) else, only familiar with Marie Curie... still, I've not yet asked my friend who works in chirped pulse amplification if she managed to get two of these.
ReplyDeleteWell, first OFL points out that it's International Women's Month and specifically International Women's Day, and these are all women who have won Nobel Prizes, and then he wants to know "why these women?". They seem like pretty good choices to me, even if I only knew MARIECURIE. Of course, I am almost always surprised that the Nobel Prize in Literature is awarded to someone I've barely heard of, but that's my fault.
ReplyDeleteA classic "solved from crosses" puzzle, with most of the downs on a pre-Monday level. ENOKI is by now an old friend and I can walk to a Japanese restaurant from our place here and get a BENTO box for lunch, even here in the wilds of NH.
Wordle aside to @JoeD-I finally read your link to NH cheaters and was relieved to see that it referred to the word game and not to the thousands and thousands of illegal voters who show up to skew our elections, although I am shocked, shocked! to think that any Granite Staters are involved in skullduggery.
Workmanlike, or workwomanlike Tuesday, MLG. My List Grows of famous women I should know, so thanks for that.
Really @pabloinnh? "...and not to the thousands and thousands of illegal voters who show up to skew our elections"... really?
DeleteOh please. Blog foul! C'mon, Rex, use your dis/approval power.
DeleteWell, I guess I'll have to turn in my Woman's Club card. If this were a test, I'd flunk.
ReplyDeleteNothing like feeling even more like an idiot than usual. Especially today.
Don't get me wrong - always grateful to learn new things, people, etc. Unlike some have said, I actually enjoy learning things from crossword puzzles.
Just don't hit me in the head with a 2 x 4 to do it, please. Thanks.
🧠🧠.75 (friendly crosses = salvation)
🎉.5
@Nancy late last night - True about assuming that is all “cheating,” but I have seen allusions to wordle cheating on Twitter so it is happening. Even if only 10% of what they found is cheating it is still true that the cheating is increasing.
ReplyDelete@mathgent - The purpose of the Nobel Prizes was to assuage Alfred’s guilt. Everything else is an ancillary effect.
Yes! to both your posts, @Lewis. The Russian Mothers also were heard during Afghanistan and my reading is they are becoming vocal now, calling out their sons being used as "cannon fodder." 🇺🇦🌻
ReplyDeleteUtterly devoid of any wordplay. I am not a good solver, but found it exceptionally easy.
ReplyDeleteKizzmekia “Kizzy” Shanta Corbett is an American viral immunologist. She is an Assistant Professor of Immunology and infectious diseases at Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health and the Shutzer Assistant Professor at the Harvard Radcliffe Institute since June 2021. Wikipedia. If you’ve had a Covid shot or you’re just alive you might want to drop her a line and thank her for her her rigor and focus and determination and exquisite mind. Doubt she was asked to mud wrestle or self park her car to lead the vax team or anywhere else she has applied her rigor and focus and determination and exquisite mind to save lives, John X.
ReplyDeleteOther than MARIE CURIE, the clue for each of the themers could have been the same:
ReplyDelete"A woman who has accomplished great things in the world and whose name you don't know (which is a real injustice) and whose name you also probably won't remember after you finish solving...unless your own name happens to be Joe Dipinto (who is good at remembering all sorts of things, not just songs from the long-ago past and would seem to have a photographic memory).
This is a worthy idea for a puzzle theme. Nay, perhaps even a noble idea. I tried to find inspiration in the solving of it. Or perhaps a sense of discovery. Or better yet, real joy. I failed completely on all three counts.
@Tom T (6:35)
ReplyDeleteRE: Hidden Diagonal Words. Liked your CAWS, and there's another terrific one today: MERMAID, starting at the M in PRIM and proceeding NE. That's one of the longer ones I can remember noticing. Fun word, but definitely out of keeping with today's puzzle theme.
Hey All !
ReplyDeleteUm, Rex, because they all won Nobels? (Answer to his silly 'Why these women?' query) (You do realize, any 5 women would've had the same question from Rex)
Anyway, nice puz. Add me to the ones who hadn't heard of any except MARIE CURIE. Got her first, and thought the others would also have rhyming names. Not to be. Also add me to the list who appreciated the easy crossers that allowed me to figure out the names.
ARBYS is a backronym (is that spelled correctly?) for Americas Roast Beef, Yes Sir.
Happy International Women's Day. Go out and enjoy your womanness.
yd -5, should'ves 2
No F's (ILL BE)
RooMonster
DarrinV
@roominster. Like your ‘backronym’. Actually Arby’s stands for Raffle Brothers — RB — who started the chain. (Daughter of one was a college friend.)
DeleteFlew through this one and thought for sure Rex would label it moo cow easy (hi @M&A), so 'challenging' was a huge surprise.
ReplyDeleteLike most I knew MARIE CURIE and had at least heard of DONNA STRICKLAND, presumably because she's a relatively recent winner and definitely not because I know anything about chirped pulse amplification.
Agreed that the subject/theme is worthwhile but does not make for a scintillating solving experience.
@OffTheGrid 6:11 thx for the link. I can't figure out how to get directly to the current puzzle!
If the timer on the app on my Kindle is to be trusted, and it isn't, this was my fastest solve ever, downs only but you can't not help but read the across clues when it's right there atop the down clue, can you?
ReplyDeleteAnyway, yes, women have won the Nobel. How much more do they want? I read in some magazine about the two women who created the vaccine for Whooping Cough. They each worked in a state lab because that was the only place that would hire them, and they only hired them because they were willing to work for 1/2 the pay of a comparably qualified man. They, and other woman similarly working for half pay, worked their asses off to develop the vaccine, create the testing protocols to assess its efficacy, and presented their results. It was dismissed initially, because gender bias, but ultimately they prevailed. They refused to name the vaccine for themselves because there were hundreds involved, not just the two in charge. They saved millions of lives. I don't remember their names. No one does. Celebrate them. Celebrate all the others who toil in darkness. Call your mother.
What a great idea to give these incredible ladies a shout out today! I actually knew two, the more obvious Mme. CURIE, and BETTY because I thought BETTY’s win was so terrific at the time. I don’t care that some of the fill was on the easy side because it’s duh, Tuesday, although I am very fond of EMISSARY today. Had the fill been Saturday worthy, I would have been tortured all day and trying to solve before the Sunday puzzle appeared. Now I have to go and read more about the accomplishments of NELLY, GERTRUDE, and DONNA.
ReplyDeleteHere's NELLY SACHS
ReplyDeleteExcerpt from Flight and Metamorphosis
(Flucht und Verwandlung)
Translated from the German by Joshua Weiner and Linda B. Parshall
If someone comes
from afar
with a language
that maybe seals off
its sounds
with a mare’s whinny
or
the chirping
of young blackbirds
or
like a gnashing saw that chews up
everything in reach—
If someone comes
from afar
moving like a dog
or
maybe a rat
and it’s winter
dress him warmly
for who knows
his feet may be on fire
(perhaps he rode in
on a meteor)
so don’t scold him
if your rug, riddled with holes,
screams—
A stranger always has
his homeland in his arms
like an orphan
for whom he may be seeking nothing
but a grave.
Another "challenging" that ran up against my fastest time for the day. These two days combined are probably my quickest Mon-Tue start to the week.
ReplyDeleteI enjoyed the puzzle well enough; like others, the only one I was familiar with was MARIE (Sklodowska) CURIE. The others were easy enough to intuit through the crosses. Despite the difficult names in the crosses, this was a Monday-level puzzle for me in terms of solve-time. As long as the crosses are fair and easy, I have no problem with obscure names or words being part of thematic clues. I like to discover something new, whether in the answers or in the clues, in puzzles (even though I'll likely forget it by the end of the week.) I found this a valiant effort for recognizing important contributions by women we may not have known about.
@Tim Carey-
ReplyDeleteUh, no. No, not really.
Maybe would have been clearer if I'd said "millions", but maybe not.
Peace Must Be Built from Below
ReplyDelete"In 1976, three innocent children were killed in a shooting incident in Belfast. The housewife and secretary BETTY WILLIAMS witnessed the tragedy. She decided to launch an appeal against the meaningless use of violence in the conflict between Protestants and Catholics in Northern Ireland. Betty was joined by the dead children's aunt, Mairead Corrigan, and together they founded the peace organization the Community of Peace People."
"Betty Williams and Mairead Corrigan received their Nobel Prize one year later, in 1977." (nobelprize.org)
@Unknown (7:59 AM yd) 👍 for your W ace
___
td (g: 16:47; pg: 18:47) / W: *4
Peace 🙏 🇺🇦 ~ Compassion ~ Tolerance ~ Kindness to all 🕊
@John X and @pabloinnh - See what happens when you violate Poe’s Law.*
ReplyDelete@WestofNatick & @Tim Carey - No. Not really. See link.
@Pete - Nice.
@Peter P - Did you use to be @Pete in blue? If so, thanks for adding the initial.
* Poe's law is an adage of Internet culture stating that, without a clear indicator of the author's intent, every parody of extreme views can be mistaken by some readers for a sincere expression of the views being parodied. -Wikipedia
I enjoyed, if that's the right word, the puzzle's shaking me by the shoulders with "Why don't you know these names?" I did know MARIE CURIE, of course, and also -- after more crosses than I should have needed -- NELLY SACHS (I taught her poetry in German classes.) And I definitely enjoyed reading Mary Lou Guizzo's note on xwordinfo. I thought the puzzle was a fine tribute to the women, their achievements, and the day.
ReplyDeleteIf a tribute puzzle is a solid “meat & potatoes” entree, must it have gravy? Could this have been better? Sure, but I’m happy to accept it for what it subtly attempts: calling attention to the dearth of women Nobelists (6% !!). And even those few are unknown. Hope that many will follow @Z’s suggestion and try these?
ReplyDeleteBS!!!
ReplyDeleteGrace Eldering and Pearl Kendrick---the women responsible for the pertussis vaccine- were not paid less than male colleagues. They were bacteriologists for Michigan's Department of Health. The pay--like so many state things was on a grade and determined and administered by bureaucrats not mysongists. Sex didn't come into play regarding their pay.
It did however come into play when the First Lady of the United States discovered their work and helped secure federal funding. God Bless Elanor Roosevelt and Grace Kendrick and Pearl Eldering.
Nobel ideas are seldom fun nor are they designed to be. Considering the day and considering the unfamiliar names with the lack of naticks and judged on its own terms it is a pretty solid puzzle.
ReplyDeleteThere is INA IMA IDA. And only one double POC,ODDS-ADS, so @Anoa may not be too upset.
I maybe would not start a women's puz with a male actor even clued with a classy woman, and maybe not had YMCA and the Village People in it. And since people are missing humor today I'll add RAG to that list. IDA and ADELE fit in nicely.
It was good having 2 in sciences and 1 in medicine. Lit and politics were to be expected.
Nightmare on Wordle Street
Wordle 262 5/6*
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🟧⬛🟧🟧🟧
🟧🟧🟧🟧🟧
@Z - I think I've always been Peter P here (unless Google/Bloggr has somehow changed how it displays names -- I haven't changed a thing); you've replied to me before, but I post maybe twice a week.
ReplyDeleteWell, M&A always lets out a slight uncomfortable groan, whenever a puz clues up a Nobel Prize winner, dude or darlin, as I usually don't know em. Today I of course knew MARIECURIE, and I think I've maybe heard about NELLYSACHS somewhere, someway. Not that I've got anything against Nobel Prize folks … but, shoot, old M&A-brain has trouble just rememberin all the neighbors' names.
ReplyDeleteAnyhoo -- tough-ish TuesPuz, but I got no big objections to that.
Puz started out with BOGIE & ADELE, and I knew both of them. I reckon they got better press coverage than most Nobelists. Other faves: SWAMPY. CRUISE. MACHU, menacinly runnin thru two of them themer answers.
staff weeject pick: IDA seems most fittin, on IWD-day. Kinda also like YUP, tho.
AIRARM. har -- UPFAKE cousin?
Thanx for the Nobel tribute, Ms. Guizzo darlin. Good job. And M&A got to meet some new, special people.
Masked & Anonymo4Us
**gruntz**
Is there going to be a quiz on this?
ReplyDeleteI feel like I just got out of a lecture and I’ve already forgotten four of the five names that were discussed.
A well-timed and noble effort, but the final result is another reminder that the road to dull is paved with good intentions.
Classical music has been promoting forgotten women in the field for som time now. (And some, like Clara Schumann, who were [really] not forgotten. A lot of stuff worthy to be rediscover, and some much less so. Even though I approve of the process of trying to correct past wrongs, I still consider this puzzle a PPP fest and dislike it, even tough I completely finished the puzzle with ease. What am I really looking for? Maybe I don't know.
ReplyDeleteWell I return from vacation (is it really vacation when you are retired?) and find out that you can cheat on Wordle (I’ll have to Google how THAT is done) and to a tribute puzzle of women I didn’t know except for Dr. Obvio. I agree with what @Rex said about the fairness of the crosses. I do think the puzzle could have benefitted by NOT confining the list to the Nobel prize (must read @OfftheGrid’s link)…I mean Margaret Thatcher, Winnie Mandela, and India Gandhi came to mind pretty quick and I wouldn’t cringe if the evil Evita were used to round out for South America.
ReplyDeleteHey, did we ever amend the U.S. Constitution to allow for an AIR ARM of the military? I mean, the USAF is an arm of the U.S. Army, right? And the Navy has an AIR ARM (well their Marine arm also has a “sub-AIRARM”), right? Hmmm. I wonder what the Founding Fathers would say about this but of course we can’t pretend to get into their minds…
Actually, despite my mentioning how easy it is to cheat in Wordle some time ago, there is no cheating because there are no rules except those you impose on yourself. Same for the NYTCW. It just makes your stats untrustworthy. Also you do not know which set of rules one is using (hard or not hard) unless you see the grids.
ReplyDeleteHow do you cheat on Wordle? (don't really want to know) The relevant question is WHY would you cheat on Wordle? I suspect low self esteem.
ReplyDeleteWhat I want to know is, does this mean the Navy is a Sea Leg?
ReplyDeleteAnd the unintentional irony of the puzzle is that once I realized the names were not going to be easily guessed, I just ignored them and focused on the downs until my little dunce’s tune played. So if your goal for a women’s tribute puzzle is to ignore women of note: mission accomplished. (Yes, yes, I promise I’ll go back and actually read the clues. Sheesh.)
@Roo monster
ReplyDeleteThank you; I was wondering where the ARBY'S name came from. I think I've only had one Arby's roast beef sandwich in my life, and to my surprise, I thought it was pretty good.
@Beezer. Yes, it's still a vacation. The only difference after retiring is you don't go to work. You still have everything else to deal with. So yes, it's a vacation.
ReplyDelete"there are no rules except those you impose on yourself"
ReplyDeleteThat is a perfect example of just how mad the world has gone.
I anticipated that this wouldn't be everyone's cuppa, but I am surprised at the level of animus. Jeez Louise!
ReplyDelete@Worlder -- yeah, I don't get it either. The way the game is, even with the most optimum of strategies, you can't really do much better than about 3 1/2 average in the long run. It's a game where four is an average result; three is good and involves some luck; five is less good, but usually means some bad luck. I play it, but it's not a particularly interesting or ego-stroking game. If I get two or three, it's just luck that I picked, say, HASTE over BASTE or PASTE or WASTE. It's fine as a mindless waste of about two minutes, but that's about it. I have a version I coded up about ten years ago as a programming exercise in Python(almost exactly the same, based on the game Lingo) that also incorporates time into the scoring. But it's not really the game itself that is notable -- it's the social aspect of one-game-per-day and everybody - for whatever reason - sharing their daily results. That's what makes it a phenomenon, in my opinion. (On the plus side, my seven-year-old likes playing the homebrew version I have and it develops her vocabulary and logical skills, so it's good for that, too. But once you have a basic grasp of logic and reasonable vocabulary, it's kind of repetitive.)
ReplyDelete@Peter P - Okay. We have @Pete in black, who is from Michigan I think, @Pete in blue, and @Peter P in blue, and all of you are just occasional posters, so I’m pretty sure I’ve confused you all into one person at various times.
ReplyDelete@Beezer - Thatcher? This tribute is for her (and I feel for Reagan, too).
@Newboy - Your link is broken for me.
FWIW - The only one I knew immediately was MARIE CURIE, but the only one I needed every cross was GERTRUDE ELION. I suspect my success rate with five random male winners would be lower. Scrolling through the list of winners I am most familiar with the Literature winners, then the Peace Prize winners, and occasionally the Economic winners. The science winners are a huge blind spot for me.
@Wordler - I suspect most often it’s streak preservation.
@albatross shell 11:03 - Word. But I’m willing to make my standard 25¢ bet that almost everyone searching for the answer rather than just guessing thinks they are cheating.
Why cheat? My stats are better than your stats! Nyah nyah nyah!! We, of course, are better than that here, and we never lie or mislead or exagggerate or hvae typos.
ReplyDelete@Arby guys--
ReplyDeleteFunny, I always assumed it was the possessive of RB, which stood for roast beef, and pronounced RB's, which is why you needed the Y.
The stuff you learn. Next it will be that Esso didn't stand for Standard Oil.
I can’t decide if the fact that girls can now enroll in Boy Scouts of America (see 45A) is supportive of the IWD theme or a modern example of how far women still have to go. One thing I’m sure of, though, is that Texas and Florida will outlaw this practice once they get wind of it. Heck, they might even incentivize citizens to report the girl cubs.
ReplyDeleteNone of the themed ladies, other than Marie Curie, rang NO BELls with me, but I can’t say that I’m upset about how I spent 7 minutes doing this puzzle (and BTW, we’re not talking 7 New Hampshire minutes here. This was an honest to God no cheating effort on my part).
Thanks for a good and appropriate IWD puzzle, Mary Lou Guizzo.
The US Air Force began as the Army Air Corps, so AIR ARM likely evolved from that.
ReplyDeleteMarie, Betty, Donna, Gertrude, and...Relly! BAr went in so fast it never occurred to me it should be BAN. Like many, zipped through this using the downs, not knowing 4 of these, but BAr/rELLY just sat there refusing to let the chimes ring.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the Poe's law link, @Z. Had forgotten, possibly never known, there was a name for that phenomenon.
The Fleet Air Arm of the Royal Navy by David Hobbs
ReplyDeleteFor the first time, this book tells the story of how naval air operations evolved into a vital element of the Royal Navy's ability to fight a three-dimensional war against both the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe. An integral part of RN, the Fleet Air Arm was not a large organization, with only 406 pilots and 232 front-line aircraft available for operations in September 1939. Nevertheless, its impact far outweigh its numbers; it was an RN fighter that shot down the first enemy aircraft of the war, and an RN pilot was the first British fighter "ace" with 5 or more kills.
So this Navy AIR ARM is the first AIR ARM to come up in a google search that is not an air gun or air rifle.
@Z - If it helps, I'm Peter P in blue, GenX male from Chicago, photographer (mostly weddings these days; photojournalism back in the day.) English lit major. Been back to doing crosswords regularly for about two years now. Still trying to get a sub-4 time. :) (And can barely conceptualize how anyone does it, much less sub-3s.)
ReplyDeleteEasy because, even though I only knew the obvious one of the five, the crosses were cake. Informative, liked it, but I’m glad puzzles like these are infrequent.
ReplyDeleteBarbara S, thank you for the gorgeous work by NELLY SACHS. I think I need a volume of her poetry, translated of course.
ReplyDeleteI loved the puzzle. We get obscure (to me) rappers and actors all the time. Obscure women who made a difference? Bring it on!
@Al Pacino:
ReplyDeleteI hear ya!!! Only Boys allowed in the Nobel Boys Club. And, did you notice the ref to the Boy Scouts doing a Ukraine on the Girl Scouts?
I don't care about women Nobelists. For that matter, I don't care about men Nobelists either. Except in Economics, or Peace. It occurred to me I would much more enjoy a puzzle about the mothers of the men in the Beatles or Rolling Stones, and I just spent a little time looking them up, and they have much more interesting stories. Haven't heard of them? You also haven't heard of the women in today's puzzle, mostly, except for Mme. Curie. And maybe BETTY WILLIAMS, whom I had heard of thanks to the Troubles, though I didn't remember her at first. And indeed she shared the Peace prize with another Irishwoman.
ReplyDelete@Unknown 11:11
ReplyDeleteARBYS was named for its founders, I believe. Too lazy right now to Goog it. The "Americas..." thing was retrofitted.
RooMonster ARBYS Is Delicious Guy
@albatross shell 10:11. Good point on BOGEY, which could have been clued in a non-proper noun way e.g. a UFO.
ReplyDeleteIt's only a vacation if you (s/he) *doesn't* have to do the same chores while on vaca that s/he did at home. Wasting precious time and money at a Disney ClusterMash doesn't change that.
ReplyDeletep.s.
ReplyDeleteJust finished readin up on all the Nobel theme stars today. An impressive bunch of ladies. Clearly, BETTY would make a much much nicer type of leader, for Russia to have. [I'da thought Putin woulda backed off in fear immediately, after Trump called his moves brilliant.]
And btw, primo weeject stacks in the NW & SE puzcorners today. And oh-so close Jaws of Themedness, on the puzsides.
M&Also
@Anonymous 10:05 Yes, I wrote that sentence badly. The only jobs available to them were the much lower paying state jobs in lower paying states. They were getting less than half the pay that men working in the private sector performing the same function as they were in the state lab. I didn't mean to imply, and it takes a little "hate reading" to think that I did, that they were paid less than men working in their lab at the same level. I'm also pretty sure that they were more qualified than the men sitting next to them getting the same pay.
ReplyDelete@Z - Jeez, you may as well tell everyone that Batman and Bruce Wayne live at the same place! Actually, I'm from New Jersey.
One more thing: I went to the site Joe DiPinto posted yesterday about cheating on Wordle. I wouldn't trust anything they say when they also say you should learn all the common 5 letter words, as they're more likely to appear. It's true that they eliminated some obscurities from the list, but a very common word in the list is no more likely to appear than a very uncommon word in the list. They'll all appear once, and only once.
ReplyDeleteHey @Lewis,
ReplyDelete(per wiki:)
“23 April 1945: In one of the rare actions of the Pacific War to involve a German submarine, U-183 was sunk off the southern coast of Borneo by the American submarine Besugo.”
Seven days later Hitler shot himself.
Ah, so THAT'S how Nazism was defeated. God bless those Besugo Boys!
@Z
ReplyDeleteHmm. Guilt exceeds actual sin? Or do self-imposed rules come with a self-imposed absolution? Wordle has never said no purals but I feel guilty everytime I ignore a plural answer. I still do not know if how second double letter shows up if in the wrong place. The rules are not very clear. I was including just going to a site that tells you the answer, not just word hunting.
@anon
Yes a line about wordle taken out of context is the perfect reason to justify your own view of the world. Yet you are the one who decided to believe in whatever set of rules you believe in. Divinely inspired or not.
Har, guess what I found? (Didn't get a link...)
ReplyDeleteOctordle.
Google it.
You're welcome.
Roo
Missed one word on my initial try.
Re: Wordle:
ReplyDelete@Peter P's perceptive and detailed analysis at 11:23 is "all ye know on earth and all ye need to know."
Or, as Madeline Kahn said: "How twue, how twue."
I think the constructor did a great job in making sure there are no Naticks, but as a result it feels like there's no bite to the puzzle. But better this way than feeling frustrated by Naticks with theme answers that are not going to be widely known.
ReplyDeleteI would say that there was a bit of a theme here, in that nearly everything was female-oriented. Sra, Adele, Ida B Wells. BSA including girls - kind of female-oriented. The Sir and Tsar are masculine, but I think there is theme going on.
ReplyDeleteAlso, thank you, OffTheGrid, for your comments. I appreciate them.
ReplyDelete@old timer:
ReplyDeleteWell... Economics isn't, by the strict rules of the Game, a Nobel Prize. It was added decades later as a sop to the Social Sciences in 1969.
real name: Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel
Arby's was founded in Boardman, Ohio, on July 23, 1964, by Forrest (1922–2008)and Leroy Raffel, owners of a restaurant equipment business who thought there was a market opportunity for a fast food franchise based on a dish other than hamburgers. The brothers wanted to call their restaurants "Big Tex", but that name was already used by an Akron business. Instead, they chose the name "Arby's," based on R. B., the initials of Raffel Brothers; although often mistaken for Roast Beef
ReplyDeleteIt is unlikely that Wordle scores generate a bell curve. For that to happen the frequency of 1s would need to be equal to frequency of 6s.
ReplyDeleteMFCTM.
ReplyDeleteBarbara S. (9:37)
Z (10:00)
Joseph Michael (10:39)
Peter P (11:23)
pabloinnh (11:39)
@Z…Yeah, yeah, I figured I’d get some guff on Thatcher…but kind of funny how you can look back on certain people almost fondly after a certain orange man and a straw-haired clown.
ReplyDeletePete,
ReplyDeleteYour sentence was fine. It was your facts that were poor. I'm almost certain the ones you're pushing now are equally poor.
Do you have any evidence to support your claim that Eldering and Kendrick were getting less than half the pay their male colleagues were getting in the public sector? What did the public sector look like in the field of bacteriology in the 1930's and `40s anyway?
Finally got to QB today, a rarity, and because of the NH connection I am adding that no, no cheating involved. If anyone knows how to cheat at SB, it ain't me babe.
ReplyDeleteI got NELLY from crosses, read the second theme clue, and knew what the theme was. Didn't help me except for MARIE CURIE, whom I think is still the only person to win two of the things (and in different sciences, at that). Like (almost)everyone else, I knew none of the others, and would have put in ELIOt if I hadn't had STERN already.
ReplyDeleteGiven ongoing events, there was a nice little sub-theme of bygone Russian rulers and bygone Russian initials (I know, not all SSRs were Russian, but still).
"there are no rules except those you impose on yourself" -- that's more or less Kant's categorical imperative, if I recall correctly.
Aside from the names of the Nobelists, it was also nice to learn that ENID OK is actually named for the Arthurian character; I'd always thought she was one of the Raffles Brothers.
It always amazes me that puzzles by females constructors are usually much easier for me to solve!
ReplyDeleteOpps, sorry for the dead link. Trying again to access the site. Obviously I remain a neophyte as your beloved Newboy.
ReplyDeletejberg,
ReplyDeleteViz Kant. Yep. I assume you agree that it's drivel.
@Anon - First, I was referring to when Ms Kendrick started working at the state labs, pre-1920. She couldn't even vote at that point, and sure as hell wasn't the beneficiary of any Equal Pay for Equal Work act. Nor can I attest to any state regulations, whether in NY or MI, but I doubt there were any. Finally, I can find no comprehensive statistics on the pay disparity between the public and private sectors in 1920, nor between men and women in 1920. The earliest pay disparity I can find is from 1940, where women earned only 60% of what men did, and is in the era where women were working at "men's" jobs while they were off at war and were desperately needed. With our starting point of the pay disparity at 60%, I feel perfectly comfortable with an estimate of 50% going back 20 years earlier, before universal suffrage, before wage equity laws, with lower wages in the public sector, and with heightened gender bias. If you have an issue with that, that's a you thing, not a me thing.
ReplyDeleteBTW, did you ever get around to admitting you were 100% wrong about monasteries? I seem to have missed that.
Really thought the Rex Rant today would be that Curie should be disqualified because she won TWO Nobels.
ReplyDeleteNice to celebrate women’s accomplishments today BUT it does seem that the only way to merit being celebrated is by winning a nobel prize…. Sigh. Doesn’t make it feel like we have come very far.
ReplyDeleteI was just so excited that I knew who Donna Strickland was. I would have been able to solve from the crosses, but knowing somewhat obscure trivia is fun!
ReplyDeletePete,
ReplyDeleteSomeone’s pants are on fire.
You were not talking about the 1920s. You were telling a story about particular women at a particular time- Kendrick and Ederling at a particular time the early to mid 1930s. You made a claim. A claim that you now acknowledge you can’t substantiate.
Instead, you use another dubious claim about a subject not under discussion.
Here’s a tip: When you’re in a hole, stop digging.
@anon
ReplyDeleteI haven't seen your proof that Pete is wrong and his circumstantial evidence suggests he his right. So it's you who should start digging or stop digging. Maybe answer his other question too if you can remember what it's about.
@Anon - I'm talking about the late 1910s when she first tried to get a job as a biologist for which she had a degree from Syracuse and some post grad work at Columbia. She worked in NY State for a while, then got a job in MI, where she stayed. I was 100% on point on what I talked about. I condensed a 5 page article to one paragraph so I didn't fully elaborate on each and every fucking aspect of her life. She was a woman who made a massive contribution to society at a time when she was supposed to just stay at home and have babies, and has remained unheralded. I've no doubt there are millions over the decades like her. Your only concern is wondering if my estimate of 50% was off by 2 or 10% or 30%. Seriously, that's the hill you want to die on? A woman trying to get a job in the field of biology in the late 1910s early 1920s and what jobs were available to her, and how much she got paid relative to a similarly qualified man? Gio was right the other day.
ReplyDeleteI appreciate how much space I take up in your head, but seriously, get a life.
Pete,
ReplyDeleteOof. Reread your post of 3:51. In that post you claim is that you were speaking of the 1920s, not the time frame when the vaccine was created. (( which is demonstrably untrue.See your post of 9:15)
Now you’ve moved your argument back another decade. This isn’t opinion. This is fact.
You made a broad, unproven claim.Then when challenged, changed it. When cahleeged again, you changed your claim a second time.
I’m sorry you’re embarrassed that you’re unable to defend your claims. But invoking hills, other commenters? That’s beneath even you. And surely, it doesn’t advance any of your ever changing your posistions.
@Newbiy - Success!
ReplyDelete@beezer - Yeah, not so much. She and Ronnie were just more subtle about their pandering to the racists and bigots in society. Granted, she was less of an out right criminal, but that’s a pretty low bar.
@Stat Person - Yep. When I asked the other day it seems like 3 or 4 guesses predominate. Roughly 75% of my 63 solves took either 3 or 4 guesses and something like that seems to be the norm.
@Albie - Well…. If there were guilt involved I’d like to think there’d be less “cheating.” I lean more towards a false sense of pride/insecurity.
@albie & @Pete - I thought you were both wiser than to argue with a fool. I’d never get sucked in by such an obvious troll… 🤣😂🤣😂🤣
{Poe’s Law required the emojis}
Shell,
ReplyDeleteTrue, Because the onus is on the one making the claim.
But you know that.
@Z - I'm only engaging to keep him from pestering you. It's my Lent observance, giving up my peace of mind for your benefit.
ReplyDeleteLate checking in today. All my comments were made already either by Rex or the gang: names except Curie were obscure but gettable, fill was dull, and was this tribute really best served up as a crossword?
ReplyDeleteAlso, it pegs everyone specifically to the Nobel Prize. So, while I might end up vaguely remembering the names as Nobel winners (which @Nancy seems to think I'll do automatically but that's not the case), I probably wouldn't remember what nationality they were or what field they were in. The theme is a very loosely connected set of Awards Trivia, basically.
@Pete
ReplyDelete😂😂😂😂
@Pete - 🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽
ReplyDeleteI'm sympathetic to those who had to do crosses for most of the Nobelists – I did, too. But, I did know GERTRUDE ELION and had the privilege of meeting her. She was an amazing scientist and person.
ReplyDeleteAnd @bocamp: sure tootin' the ELION/MERCK cross gave pause. Elion worked for Burroughs Wellcome!
ODD ODE
ReplyDeleteMARIE, DONNA, NELLY,
GERTRUDE and then BETTY,
no IDYL IN PRIM pajamas,
I'MA SATYR for those MAMAS.
--- SIR MAC MERCK
This is a great tribut for International Women’s Day. But a snappy revealer would have helped to tie it all together. Also, there were way too many little bits of glue holding it all together - IDA, IMA, BSA, CDR, ALA, RNA, SSR, INA etc. It’s hard to pack so much theme without resorting to a few, but this one had a few too many.
ReplyDeleteWell, thank goodness we've found someone who can amplify my chirped pulse! Now maybe I can sleep at night.
ReplyDeleteTwo kealoas greet me right out of the box: BOGIE/BOGey and BAN/BAr. The latter is seldom mentioned but occurs often. However, the choice between NELLY and rELLY is pretty clear, as are all the crosses to these names. Crossword solving is school. If you're lucky, you LEARN stuff. As an earlier blogger said: Hello, Mary Lou (goodbye, heart!). You're my DOD, with most honorable mention for all the ladies you taught me about. Birdie.
I agree with @Foggy that a revealer would snap this all together.
ReplyDeleteThat said, even with the number of names, the crosses made solving Tuesday levelish. And the many famous women was a treat.
Diana, Lady-in-Waiting for Crosswords