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Relative difficulty: Medium
THEME: A Halloween riddle...
Q: WHAT IS A / GHOST'S FAVORITE / DESSERT? (17A: With 27- and 35-Across, a Halloween riddle)
A: BOOBERRY PIE AND / I SCREAM (43A: With 60-Across, answer to the riddle)
Word of the Day: Picaroon (43A: Picaroon=>BANDIT) —
n.
- A pirate.
- A pirate ship.
• • •
Pretty easy, though a barrage of annoying, gnat-like little proper nouns kept me from flying through this thing as fast as I thought I should have. I didn't care too much for this Halloween-week offering. Too cutesy. Pulled straight from a joke book for third-graders. Much preferred yesterday's simple, smooth, clever spookfest. This tired groaner isn't fit to hold center stage in a NYT puzzle. As for the gnats:
- 15A: ___ Greene, "The Godfather" gangster (MOE) — seen the movie, of course, but the name just didn't come. I wanted ABE (likely bec. of Vigoda)
51A: Italian TV channel (TRE) — I still can't really believe this clue is serious. How in the world should I know an Italian TV channel? Or is the idea that it's just a number ... channel three? Weird.- 3D: Elaine ___, George W. Bush's only labor secretary (CHAO) — I'm sure I've seen her and been flummoxed by her before. The only CHAO I know readily is Knives CHAO, a major character in the "Scott Pilgrim" comics (and, I assume, the movie, though I haven't seen it). Although her name's spelled CHAU, so nevermind.
- 39D: Barnard's ___, locale in "Great Expectations" (INN) — ??? I see a theme developing. Minor character in a movie, obscure foreign TV channel, minor figure in a pres. admin., some place in a book ... clearly the cluer is trying really hard to throw down little speed bumps, likely anticipating that the hackneyed joke will be far too easy for Thursday solvers to get...
- 42D: Debbie who won three swimming gold medals at the 1968 Olympics (MEYER) — I have some vague memory of having encountered her in crosswords past.
Gotta go finish grading exams so I can get out of town this weekend without too much work hanging over my head. Also, I want to get back downstairs to catch the end of the Giants/Rangers game. So ... Let's see ... what's left to say. Only real trouble spot of any size was the NE, where I had the tail ends of all the 7-letter Acrosses, but couldn't bring any of them down! Unh!
Of those three answers, I'm most embarrassed by not getting BRIDGES much, much sooner (7A: George Washington and others). The only answer my brain really wanted was GEORGES, which, as you can see, is ridiculous. Never read "Jane Eyre" (that I can recall), but that awesome Rochester quote kind of makes me want to (16A: "The poison of life," per Brontë's Rochester). My first thought upon reading that clue: ABSINTHE. I had an absinthe cocktail this past weekend in New York. Surprisingly delicious. My friend and host (who paid, god bless her) just kept ordering interesting-sounding cocktails, then not liking them and passing them down to me and our mutual friend, who liked them quite well, thank you very much. My original order was a whisky drink with cracked-pepper-infused Sazerac rye and some kind of ginger liqueur and possibly something else in an old-fashioned glass, on the rocks. It was bleeping brilliant. Loved seeing YAKIMA in the grid (45D: Washington city, river or tribe)—I know it well because a. my father grew up in the state of Washington and we went there every summer for years, b. Raymond Carver (one of my favorite writers) grew up in YAKIMA, c. my friend Robert used to call games for the YAKIMA Bears.And so to bed.
Signed, Rex Parker, King of CrossWorld
[Follow Rex Parker on Twitter]
The city and river are Yakima, but the tribe is Yakama. Just saying...
ReplyDeleteLoved the idea of the puzzle, and was fun to solve, but man that riddle is ancient. I mean, it is older than most ghosts. Certainly in every book of jokes for kids.
ReplyDeleteSurprised and disappointed the Mighty Klahn did not invent his own riddle for the occasion.
Best thing I can say is that it made me feel better after the weekly FIREBALL puzzle blew up my brain in the afternoon. (It also has a boo or two.)
Busy days (and nights) here. I am doing the puzzle everyday and catching the ever-enjoyable blog and comments. My experience tracked @Rex on this one. Abe first and then MOE and Georges before BRIDGES (ouch). I had tAcoMA -> tAKoMA -> YAKoMA -> YAKIMA. Oh, well. I got it in the end. Back to work.
ReplyDeletePuzzle was on the easy side for me. Got a little bogged down with 9D with "I moved on" instead of I'M OVER IT. And 54A with tissues before Kleenex. But I got over it!
ReplyDeleteCute Puzzle!
IMOVERIT was the only answer I liked. But I really really liked it!
ReplyDeleteI love Great Expectations and have read it multiple times. I still needed two crosses before I realized, "Oh, it's just INN." I was a bit surprised but not bothered by it.
ReplyDeleteI highly recommend the Scott Pilgrim movie. Jane Eyre, not so much - though I agree, it's an excellent quote. I never really got the Brontes. Jaspar Fforde's "The Eyre Affair" is hilarious though.
@The Hag, love the Tuesday Next series.
ReplyDeleteAs a fan of bad jokes this puzzle was a treat to solve.
For our store houses of knowledge the Sazerac was the first cocktail (source American Cocktail Museum NOLA) and the best ones can be found at the Carousel Bar also in NOLA... where I will be for T-Day. The living dead themed bars here in the miniapple serve Absinthe infused Zombies.
I think the kayak/bike/ski rack on my car is a YAKIMA.
The winds have died down here in the mighty midwest so it is safe to put out pumpkins. @sethg any ideas?
*** (3 stars) Capture the spirit of the season.
I had the R .M...E and thought maybe ROMANCE was the poison of life....
ReplyDeleteMost of the puzzle wasn't too hard thought and now it's time to go eat some Booberry cereal....
It must be Channel Three (TRE). I didn't know how to spell YAKIMA, and so I had Yakama, and I still think Booberry Pie and a scream is a better riddle answer. Thanks to anonymous for giving me some solace.
ReplyDeleteYes, he was going for Channel Three, but the logical response to "Italian TV Channel" is the 3-letter RAI. So I was slowed down with that for a while.
ReplyDelete@glimmerglass, I also ended up with BOOBERRYPIEANDASCREAM. You know, a piece of pie with ASCREAM on the side. And, as it turns out according to @anon. 12:29 a.m., with this answer we get the tribe name right!
ReplyDeleteWe have a bleed over at 22A with BAT.
My only writeover was SassY before SAUCY.
@dk, no wind here but it wasn't safe to put out our pumpkin as the squirrels ate it. I usually carve on Halloween but their gnawing hasn't left me much to work with.
Well, I didn't laugh at the joke, but laughed at "genie" and "bridges" (had "arim" for a while, slowing me down) so my day is made.
ReplyDeleteAlso for a while, mis-read the cross-reference and thought "booberry pie and kleenex" as a ghost's dessert made some kind of sense.
Had to look up e-stop. On a bar? A control panel is a bar? What am I missing?
Estoppal is a legal term, to stop something, basically, thus bar at the bar.
ReplyDeleteI'm not getting the Capital of the US answer. . .DOL. I'm sure I will one y'all tell me! :)
Same writeovers as @ChefWen and @Joho, and as a former bartender I wanted 23A to be 'cut off' but it couldn't be. Boo.
ReplyDeleteI have not seen a FANTA soda since the Nixon Administration. Do they still make that stuff?
I thought ASH crossing ASHE was iffy, but if El Jefe will let it go, I won't pick nits.
Busy day today. Must go to the Goodwill and other thrift shops to find a cheap black suit that doesn't fit. A group of friends is going to a Friday night Homoween party as The Addams Family, and I -- the tallest -- will be Lurch.
Emshi! (A Korean dish that isn't quite done fermenting yet.) -- jesser
@Anon 8:42 - Capital and DOL (Dollar), economic terms
ReplyDelete@Falconer
ReplyDeleteToday's author is KAHN not Klahn
P>G>
@KKKC, Bar, AT the bar, not ON the bar. The first bar is estop, a legal term, and the second bat is the body of lawyers in a jurisdiction. Lawyers use the term estop, a term in equity meaning what it sounds like, stopping someone from doing something unlawful.
ReplyDeleteDe nada....
YAKIMA is a city, river (and county) in Washington, but the tribe is YAKAMA.
ReplyDeleteMy sister lives in Yakima. The tribe is, indeed, Yakama.
ReplyDeleteIs it kosher to use QB instead of quarterback in a clue when the answer is not an abbreviation?
Easy, fun puzzle, but at a Tuesday level.
My wife and I will continue a Halloween tradition we began just a year ago. Get the hell out of town! We live in the only area of densely-packed homes in a township otherwise zoned 3-acre (or more) minimum. The kids come here by the busload, because it's the only place they don't have to walk a quarter mile between candy bars. Last year we did touristy things in Washington; this year, Philadelphia.
Seemed like this puzzle could be a strong candidate for the most three letter answers (and, as Rex noted, arbitrarily clued, eg, GEE, HEY, MOE, TRE et al).
ReplyDeleteOnly write-over was tAcoMA, but I solve in ink and am careful when so many answers can work.
I'm not as familiar with the various constructors as many of you, but I recognize David Kahn and was expecting a much better puzzle than this one.
PS Another nit - BAT crossing GRABAT
Wikipedia suports those who say Yakama for the tribe. On the other hand Dictionary.Com supports the NYT:
ReplyDeleteYak·i·ma /ˈyækəˌmÉ”, -mÉ™/ Show Spelled
[yak-uh-maw, -muh] Show IPA
–noun, plural -mas, ( especially collectively ) -ma for 3.
1. a city in S Washington. 49,826.
2. a river in S central Washington. 203 mi. (327 km) long.
3. a member of a North American Indian people of Washington.
4. the Sahaptin language of the Yakima. Dictionary.com Unabridged
Based on the Random House Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2010.
Cite This Source | Link To Yakima
Encyclopedia
Yakima
Sahaptin-speaking North American Indian tribe that lived along the Columbia, Yakima, and Wenatchee rivers in what is now the south-central region of the state of Washington. As with many other Sahaptin Plateau Indians, they were primarily salmon fishers before colonization
Learn more about Yakima with a free trial on Britannica.com.
Encyclopedia Britannica, 2008. Encyclopedia Britannica Online.
Cite This Source
Yak, yak, yak....
Gracias, anons.
ReplyDeleteWiki gave me all this engineering talk about buttons and trains and emergency stops (e-stops!). Should've clicked on "estoppel," but who knew? I was still thinking bar=alcohol and hoping for some hip, fun bartending jargon.
Guess I should stop reading Keith Richard's autobiography (which, btw is brilliant) before doing the puzzle.
Like the riddle. But had no idea--too, too spaced out across the grid, even with ISCREA0M in place.
ReplyDeleteWanted Ghost off the G, then decided against it. Is a genie really a 'spirit'?
Of all the things to kvetch about, a three-letter Christian name? A major character from the secomd-most well-regarded movie of all time? As Fredo said, "Mike, you do not come to Las Vegas and talk (about) a man like MOE Greene like THAT!"
Liked BRIDGES, not that I got it. I, too, kept looking back at the clue to see if georGES would work. Funny how that works.
Theme absolutely pinned one down in this puzzle. No way of working around it, given the grid construction. Tuesday construction commenter--gimme a break.
Had MAn not MAC at 1A as Nhao seemed OK. @Elisa and Andrea: RAI, sassy and tissues. Took a while to sort them out but did. Yesterday it was more fun to pick out the inside references. Halloween is Sunday; enough already.
ReplyDeleteMy street is made into a pedestrian walkway during the Village parade so I can sit and watch the costumed people go by. Have a good day.
Way too easy for a Thursday.
ReplyDeleteI much prefer a ghoulish holiday theme like yesterday to a grade school riddle. I expected more from Mr. Kahn.
Too much crying in this one as we yell Ach, Ole, and Boo.
@ The Hag and @ dk,I really enjoyed Fforde's Tuesday Next series as well. What an imagination.
My dogs hate/love Halloween. To avoid chaos with the dogs and revengeful vandalism from the dressed up delinquents I close the dog door and put a bucket of candy on the stoop. Let the greedy little buggers help themselves.
Did this while waiting at another doctor's office. Now I have had all my yearly checkups!!!
ReplyDeleteThought the puzzle was very easy for a thursday and of course had heard the riddle.
I took the BATs at 22 A and 22D to be part of the Halloween Week theme.
ReplyDelete(Hi, 1 A!)
Since I had never heard of the riddle, I thought it was fun. I agree about the short fill. The NE corner was the last to fall because I really could not conjure BRIDGES for a long time.
ReplyDelete@Andrea, I agree that I'M OVER IT is excellent. Particularly in close proximity with REMORSE and its clue. Words to live by!
QDI says it's EASY.
For the third straight day, I finished with two incorrect squares. I had TRi/iNOL and ElATO/lIO. So it goes.
ReplyDeleteDidn't like the theme at all. Come on, "booberry"? There's just not very much to say about this one, other than a few good non-theme answers or clues -- IMOVERIT, BANDIT, YAKIMA, and a man my father built into a legend in my mind, the Old Perfessor Casey STENGEL.
I blazed through this, until I got to the SE and put in SAssY for SASSY, kleenEx for TISSUES, and all for MEA, which took me a while to fix. And I still had my fourth fastest Thursday time ever!
ReplyDeletecaptcha: lactsupc: what mammals do
I call foul on the Italian channel. Like Elisa@8:27, I also had RAI, which is the Italian equivalent of the BBC. Calling TRE is just arbitrary; why not UNO, DUE, etc?
ReplyDeleteAnd I also had ASCREAM. I like the sound of it much better: "booberry pie and a scream".
Definitely a cutesie puzzle.
Just printed off a pile of NYT puzzes. Facin' some mighty mighty big catchup work. Was doin' a road tour out East, and had to work mostly USAToday puzzes. Not many hotels hand out NYTimes papers. Those USAT puzzes are gettin' better, BTW.
ReplyDelete[...time passes...]
Have now worked today's NYT ThursPuz. Didn't seem to put up much of a fight. Riddles, huh? Cool grid layout. Almost like a haunted house. Big rooms and little ones. Did the NYT give up on U's all together, while I was away? Oh, wait, there's one. OK.
Good to see 44 is still hittin' the sauce and hammerin' the crosswords.
Found it more challenging than it probably should have been, but hey, Thursday puzzles shouldn't be gimmes.
ReplyDeleteI just worked on a puzzle by the great Cox & Rathvon which had a knock-knock joke in its theme, so I probably shouldn't be overly kvetchy about the joke, but I'm with Rex on this one.
Nice clues for GENIE, ESTATE, and DOL, and glad to see that I wasn't the only one whose brain kept throwing up GEORGES for 7A. COSETS just looks bloody weird in the grid: I keep wanting to throw in an L, an R, or a TE in the middle there...
I agree with @elisa and @mexgirl. The Italian tv channel is RAI. There is RAI Uno, RAI Due, and RAI Tre.
ReplyDeleteAren't there several other better clues for TRE?
Liked the puzzle and the theme, a timely one.
ReplyDeleteMeyer,42D, was a gimme today. During the summer of '68, my little brother and I played Olympics- he was about 4 and a half, and I was 6. We were 'practicing' swimming events in the basement, which had a put-put green carpet over a cement floor. He climbed onto a table and,(probably at my insistence), pretending he was Debbie Meyer on the starting block, dove (belly slammed?)onto the floor and broke his collarbone.
An unforgettable Olympic moment.
Here's another CHAO for you- Rosalind who played Klinger's wife, Soon-Lee, on the last couple episodes of MASH and the spin off, After MASH.
ReplyDeleteShe's had a very busy career since then, too.
Now that I know ...A SCREAM is wrong, I like the puzzle even less--"a scream" can be part of a punny desert, but "I scream"? Give me a break!
ReplyDeleteI scream.
ReplyDeleteYou scream,
We all scream
for ice scream!
From the "no good deed goes unpunished" file: when solving today's puzzle I too started with RAI and made a note to gripe that "RAI is a network, not a channel ... there are several channels broadcast by the RAI." When I corrected my fill I thought "wow, this clue is nitproof."
ReplyDeleteThe Yakama tribe adopted that spelling about 15 years ago. They are still largely referred to as the Yakima, especially by non-Yakamas. My wife grew up in Toppenish and Wapato, WA, both on the res, and still has family farming in the area. None of them got the memo about the spelling change, either.
OldCarFudd,
Technically, only abbreviations that are not pronounced as written require signals. We say "Thursday" for "Thu." so it's an abbreviation. We say "naz dack" for NASDAQ and "cue bee" for QB, so they may be used in clues (or be clued) without an abbreviation signal. Note that they may be signaled, especially early in the week, but it's an editorial option.
Midday report of relative difficulty (see my 7/30/2009 post for an explanation of my method):
ReplyDeleteAll solvers (median solve time, average for day of week, ratio, percentile, rating)
Thu 13:35, 18:57, 0.72, 6%, Easy
Top 100 solvers
Thu 6:56, 9:06, 0.76, 13%, Easy
technically since there are two spellings of YAKiMA/YAKaMA and that both ISCREAM and ASCREAM make sense, it might be moot and this could be the first puzzle that there are two correct different solves possible!
ReplyDeleteI solve on paper, so which one did Mr. Happy Pencil advocate?
@Badir
Seems like you STILL want SAssY!
When in doubt, esp late week, I go for KLEENEX over TISSUES unless the word is on the bottom and needs those SSSs
@ACM - Only the YAKAMA people changed their name, it is still the city YAKIMA which sits on the YAKIMA river. Mr Happy Pencil, being culturely insensitive, prefers the YAKIMA spelling.
ReplyDelete@dk and Two Ponies. I love all of Fforde's books. It was worth having read Wuthering Heights just to laugh at the Heathcliff intervention scene. Also Millon de Floss made me realize I'd never read any Eliot and I've since become a big fan.
ReplyDelete@jesser. I laughed audibly at your definition of "emshi"!
@ACME - Your comment reminds me of my one wrong letter at the 2010 ACPT, at the first-letter crossing of ZOWIE and ZAG, which I had as WOWIE
ReplyDeleteand WAG, (if I remember correctly, which I may not.) When I tell that story to crossword people, they are understanding. But once I had too much too drink and told the story to a non-crossword friend, who asked, "Did you protest? Is it possible to have a correct answer to a crossword puzzle which is not what the constructor intended?" (For the sake of simplicity, I did not mention CLINTON/BOBDOLE.)
Hi Bob, you are on a roll today!
ReplyDeleteOK puzzle, unknown riddle to me, but pretty good fill. I also started with tissues and sassy.
I also wanted RAI, because it is shown all over Europe, and there is plenty of boobery going on.
Are the Yakimas related to the Clackamas?
@OldCarFudd: we once rented a little house in a small-lot neighborhood; I ran out of candy at 9, and the teens that showed up after threw the pumpkins against the house and stole the birdbath. Fun. In this house nobody has ever braved the dark driveway.
Also, am looking forward to that KR autobiography.
@Sparky: Do you have an upstairs window to watch the parade???? Please?
I am not Sfingi, but I look like it.
Martin - Thank you, both for the update on the Yakama spelling and the clarification about abbreviations.
ReplyDeleteWhere did you get said bleeping brilliant cocktail? Inquiring fans in NYC want to know.
ReplyDeleteAgree with you on the puzzle, although something about the MAC/ACH/ASH/MOE corner amuses me in a way I can't quite identify...
Hated it. DNF
ReplyDeleteAs @Archeoprof said - It's actually RAI TRE, and yes, there's an RAI DUE. This is esoterica, which was true of too much of this puzzle. ORR, REMORSE, COSETS.
Also, I got all the sports wrong. I finally learn QBs Punt. So, no, they PASS, and they aren't Queen's Bishops.
HEY and GEE and ENE and DOL s--t the bed.
What's this AMIDST and amongst stuff? What's wrong with AMID and among?
Do EELS have to be everywhere? Why not krait?
But, definitely EELS on my CW mural.
Had I MOVEd on for IM OVER IT, which is kind of funny.
Had tACoMA, of course.
OK, I vented.
New word - picaroon, Liked MOE and
FANTA.
Gotta catch this Fford guy.
In the 1950s Prudential Insurance built a large office building along Michigan Avenue in Chicago (the first skyscraper built in Chicago at the time since the Great Depression) over the ICC railroad tracks. The railroad sold the air rights to Prudential and the largest title company in Chicago insured the title. The City sued, claiming that it owned the air rights over the railroad tracks. The title company won on the basis that the City was ESTOPped from claiming those rights because it had never claimed those rights previously. It was an historic decision because it was the first time the doctrine of estoppel was ever held against a municipality in Illinois....
ReplyDelete@JD,
ReplyDeleteLower east side, exotic-sounding name ... I'll have to ask the friend who took me. ~RP
Kahn is sai to have collaborated with his kid on this puzzle. If so good.
ReplyDeleteI don't like this kind of puzzle for the same reason that I don't like quotation puzzles. That said, I solved it with no trouble and in good time. The riddle is corny but mildly amusing. Cluing does seem to be artificially stretching for Thursday difficulty.
@ Rex, I finally read your writeup and see you used the word groaner. Last night I thought about commenting initially with the one word Groan but was too tired and went to bed....
ReplyDeleteThis week's relative difficulty ratings. See my 7/30/2009 post for an explanation. In a nutshell, the higher the ratio, the higher this week's median solve time is relative to the average for the corresponding day of the week.
ReplyDeleteAll solvers (this week's median solve time, average for day of week, ratio, percentile, rating)
Mon 7:31, 6:57, 1.08, 81%, Challenging
Tue 9:17, 8:56, 1.04, 63%, Medium-Challenging
Wed 12:45, 11:44, 1.09, 77%, Medium-Challenging
Thu 13:42, 18:57, 0.72, 7%, Easy
Top 100 solvers
Mon 3:42, 3:42, 1.00, 51%, Medium
Tue 4:41, 4:36, 1.02, 61%, Medium-Challenging
Wed 6:00, 5:46, 1.04, 68%, Medium-Challenging
Thu 6:29, 9:06, 0.71, 6%, Easy
The 5th and 4th lowest median solve times of 72 Thursday puzzles for the two groups of solvers. Piece o' cake.
Very easy Thursday, wanted RAI, got stuck on MIX and MINE, of all things.
ReplyDeleteOooh, Friday is up!!
Spertes, no comment.
I was going to point out the YAKIMA/YAKAMA difference, but many others have done before me. If the variant spelling is allowed, then I SCREAM/A SCREAM would not be the first puzzle with alternate solutions. I'm thinking of the famous BOBDOLE/CLINTON ambiguous puzzle some years back.
ReplyDeleteThere is, however, a real error in the puzzle. COSET is a term from mathematical group theory (co-set). Roughly, a coset is a "subgroup" of a group offset by a certain amount. A coset is not a subgroup (that is, a smaller group) unless the offset value is zero. The clue "Math groups" is incorrect.
As a mathematician, I agree with Eric Halsey!
ReplyDeleteA Day later it is probably unlikely @jesser will come back here, but too busy for the past two days to read or post. Fanta soda does indeed still exist, and they started a clever ad campaign here in Lalaland over the summer with Fantanas: four shapely young women in clever 70s-referenced tight outfits (complete with white go-go boots). Each girl's outfit represents a Fanta flavor: grape, orange, strawberry and pineapple. Were there Fantanas back then, or is this a new invention? Not sure.
ReplyDeleteUndure: when you are not willing to put up with something
Syndicated paper puzzler.
ReplyDeleteLoved learning PICAROON.
Successfully slogged through most of it until I hit the NE, where a combination of wrong write-ins and a brain going to RUT at 12D ("What you will"=ESTATE) yanked me to a dead ESTOP. Ran out of randomity thinking for awhile, I guess: refused to discard CLEF (for 8D "Staff symbol"=REST) or MED (22A "Club for swingers"=BAT); and, for whatever reason, I couldn't get over the idea that "What you will" had something to do with TWELFTH NIGHT.
Not to let REMORSE poison my day, I immediately took it out on another puzzle: tore through it and IMOVERIT all now. Except for BOOBERRY PIE: the dogs' stuffed toys are still dodging my foot.
From the syndicate: Never having heard of an ESTOP, my math "groups" were COSECS (cosecants) which I recall from HS trig courses. Of course, that made my bar, at the bar an ESCOP which sounds mighty fine to me. Next Halloween, might even mix some with my booberry pie...
ReplyDeleteIt felt a little strange solving a Halloween-based puzzle on December 2, but it was still fun. And like @NarB above, picaroon was new to me, so thanks Rex for making it the WOD. On to Friday - another Halloweenie, maybe?
ReplyDelete