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Relative difficulty: Easy-Medium (themers were the only tricky part)
Theme answers:
- TOOK NOTICE (17A: Also + Frozen water)
- NINETIES KID (24A: Three squared + Slide)
- CARAMEL DELITE (36A: Italian "darling" + Top-shelf)
- CREEPING OUT (47A: Northern tribe + Toe trouble)
- CARBON DATE (57A: Auto + Consumed)
Vanilla cookies topped with caramel, sprinkled with toasted coconut, and laced with chocolatey stripes. (ABC Bakers)
• • •
This puzzle didn't make much sense to me. I like a theme without a revealer if the core tenets of the theme are clear, but they weren't perfectly clear to me today. So ... we get two ultra-dull clues linked by a "+" and that "+" is supposed to represent the word in the shaded squares. Those shaded words are all verbs (or nouns, I suppose) meaning "unite," "fuse," something like that. And then, in each case, you get one long unclued answer. The whole premise felt shaky to me—not a tight enough connection between "+" and whatever was in those shaded squares; and those shaded words didn't feel like the tightest set, either. And I don't really believe NINETIES KID is a thing any more than any other decade + KID is a thing. Was I a SEVENTIES KID or an EIGHTIES KID? An argument can be made either way, and either way, neither one of those really belongs in a puzzle. Also, I had absolutely no idea what a CARAMEL DELITE was supposed to be. Zero. Figured it was a type of ice cream. Had to look it up after, only to discover it's basically the same thing as a Samoa (Girl Scout Cookie). Unclued answers are already operating from a joy deficit. They really need to sing. There's no pleasure in having neither a clue (as in, the clue is missing) ... nor a clue (as in, I have no idea what this answer is). The shaded squares don't always break across the two elements of each themer, either, making for an inelegant execution. "KID" and "OUT" are sitting in their respective answers completely unconnected, left out of the bonding scheme entirely. I realize the bonds are only supposed to "bond" the two clued answers (e.g. NINE and SKID), not the words in the longer phrase (e.g. NINETIES and KID), but still, when the "tie" is not "tying" the elements in the longer answer together, it looks funny/failed. Three of the answers manage to get it right, but NINETIES KID and CREEPING OUT miss. This feels like a first draft of an idea. There's potential here ... but the final product doesn't feel fully baked.
The fill is, once again, unfortunate. Bad enough that I stopped to take a screenshot before I ever got out of the NW:
The only difficulty today was parsing the themers. That REY-for-REN mistake was easy enough to correct, and I don't remember any other missteps except USSR for CCCP (10A: Letters on Ivan Drago's tracksuit in "Rocky IV"). I did need several crosses to get MELON (33D: Noggin), but on a Thursday, I'd expect to "need several crosses" to get many answers, and that just wasn't the case today.
Bullets:
- 1A: Traditional roofing material for a Cape Cod-style house (CEDAR) — I wanted SHALE (?) and THATCH (which wouldn't fit).
- 22D: Clutch producer (HEN) — a group of eggs laid by a HEN is called a "clutch."
- 49D: When tripled, a 1962 Elvis movie title (GIRLS) — not an Elvis film title that leaps to mind. I couldn't get the VIVA part of VIVA, LAS VEGAS out of my head. "VIVA VIVA VIVA!"—not a movie title. The part of my brain occupied by "GIRLS, GIRLS, GIRLS" ... has been taken (I think this means I'm definitely an EIGHTIES KID, for better or, in this case, worse):
- 15A: Tourist hot spot in Uttar Pradesh (AGRA) — location of the Taj Mahal, which, if you have solved crosswords for any length of time, you damn sure know
- 57D: Greenhorn (CUB) — couple of old-fashioned synonyms for you. I have never heard CUB used in this way except when followed by the word "reporter." I'm much more apt to use "greenhorn," which is a funny word. Curious about its etymology. Here we go ... according to someplace called etymonline (I'm just going to assume it's legit):
greenhorn(n.)
mid-15c., "horn of an animal recently killed," also "young horned animal," from green (adj.) in sense of "new, fresh, recent" + horn (n.). Applied to new soldiers from c. 1650; extended to any inexperienced person by 1680s.
That's all. See you next time.
Wait, one more thing: For The Next Week Only, I will once again be accepting ...
🌲🐈Holiday Pet Pics🐕🌲
... continuing what is now apparently an annual tradition of posting pictures of readers' pets in "holiday" settings (whatever that means to you). Send your pics to rexparker at icloud dot com. Please include your pet's name, as well as any info you think relevant. I'll post several of them a day in the run up to Christmas and (likely) through the New Year. Here's a teaser for you:
 |
| [Christmas crime scene ... Santa's body was never found] [Thanks, Lesley (you didn't give me kitty's name!)] |
[Follow Rex Parker on BlueSky and Facebook and Letterboxd]
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I found it much easier than most recent Thursdays. Only the NE gave me pause, trying to remember the first "C" in CCCP (Soviet Russia), and trying to decide between MARA and "Tara" Rooney. The common thread between the shaded clues was a help in spots, even absent a revealer.
ReplyDeleteBob, MARA is the last name. It is Rooney MARA. I only know because I believe she was in the U.S. version of The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo.
DeleteThe Mara girls, girls (only two of 'em, Kate and Rooney) are grandchildren of the Pittsburgh Steelers owner, Art Rooney. The Rooney Rule sought to promote DEI in coaching and QBs in the NFL. Given the number and success of Black HCs and QBs, seems to have been a success. Kinda overlooked by fans and anti-woke fanatics.
DeleteA wonderful actress born in Bedford NY (like my wife). She (Rooney) was born into both the Rooney family (Pittsburgh Steelers) and Mara family (NY Giants), thus her name. She gets down on her knees every day and thanks God she has no connection to the Jets.
Delete@Liveprof
DeleteLOL!
Literally, I burst out laughing!
Roo
ReplyDeleteEasy, helped by the fact that I ignored the theme clues until I was done. I got that the long acrosses were common two-word phrases (although it took some reparsing to get NINETIES KID at 24A) and that you had to ignore the unclued word in the shaded squares for the answer to match its clue. But the "binding" connection between (among?) the shaded words seems just too tenuous. Liked it even less than @Rex: * _ _ _ _
Overwrites:
slate before CEDAR at 1A.
Totally blanked on TILDA Swinton (25D). Tried several female first names including hILDA before I got it right.
A five-letter mattress company starting with S can either be SEaly or SERTA (27A). Today I guessed correctly.
One WOE, newscaster NEIL Cavuto at 60A
12 minutes for me, so easy-medium for a Thursday. I was kinda looking for a revealer, something to "TIE" it all together and make me say "aha" but it never came. Then I went back and looked at it for a while and figured out--oh, that word in the shaded boxes KNOTs, TIEs, BONDs etc the 2 clued parts of the answer together into a longer answer that makes sense. I liked it a little more than @REX did--mainly because the long answers were fun to discover, CARBONDATE and CREEPINGOUT and NINETIESKID. So I'll give it 3.25 stars... Thanks, Stephen and Jeff! : )
ReplyDeleteThis thing definitely needed a reveal. I filled it all in, stared at it for a while attempting to discern the theme, and finally threw in the towel. Yesterday we had nonsense-speak in the grid, today we have cryptic clues. It hasn’t been a banner week for the Old Gray Lady.
ReplyDeleteThere was enough standard crosswordese to get footholds here and there, so solving the puzzle wasn’t that difficult, but it’s not very enjoyable to parse together every cross to end up with CARAMEL DELITE, which appears to be a brand name with a weird spelling that means nothing to me.
Please, please, please Will - open up your secret stash of Robyn puzzles and run one tomorrow.
In an interesting bit of irony, I just realized that I have an unopened box of CARAMEL DELITE in my pantry. I bought it last spring - not by name, I just asked the young scout for “the coconut ones”. Anyone know what the shelf life is on those things - are they still edible ?
DeleteGotta agree about the 'Old Gray Lady." It hasn't been a banner anything for some time. Yes, please bring back Robyn!
DeleteStraightforward; timewise about a medium or just slightly easier than that. Not a whole lot of wordplay: the cluing seemed very literal, as in all the themed answers (yes, an auto is a CAR, and consumed means ATE), and in I'd say most of the fill (ANIMALS are the veterinarian's interest, yes). It made for a pretty ho-hum puzzle.
ReplyDeleteHad to hold off on whether it was going to be mARS or TARS. No sleeping pill aid or similar was forthcoming under the "m" hypothesis, and so SERTA it eventually was, but really who cares, mia CARA? The mascot of a bed manufacturer, whoop-de-do.
NERDS as the "uncool bunch", sheesh. What is this, 1950s HIGH School? Just so trite, so hackneyed. So-called NERDS are frequently the most interesting of the bunch. I guess we're supposed to summon the image of Poindexters with slide rules or something, but so-called NERDS among today's kids tend to have lots going on, and they're mostly pretty cool from my observations, so please just cut out this dumb crap already. If you want to use NERDS, fine, just try to be a little more creative in the cluing, will ya? Summon your creative NERD that lurks inside.
They're not really connected I don't think, except possibly in terms of the timelines where they really flourished, but I tend to bracket SHEENA Easton with Sheila E. One of them might be Scottish and one of them might have played with Prince. Or something. It's a crossword -- you don't really have to know much, really, just the most superficial nodding "I've sort of heard of that" acquaintance is often sufficient. Sometimes I can't be bothered to look it up post-solve, and today is one of those days.
Okay, that'll do for now. Hope you have a good day.
BOTH Sheena Easton and Sheila E worked with Prince, which may be why you're confusing them.
DeleteIt’s a stretch, but maybe “uncool” is cuing the 1950s, the decade when I was an uncool NERD.
DeleteI think the term NERD implies a certain social awkwardness, so I think "uncool bunch" is a perfectly good clue.
Delete@Anon 9:40AM. Well, maybe that better explains why I was unconsciously bracketing them, besides their having the same initials. Thanks for the pointer.
Delete@Jnlzbth. I think there might be some slight semantic shift here. The AI overview that inevitably pops up mentions both the social awkwardness aspect, and also the aspect where NERD describes someone passionately interested in a specific subject (often a technical one). In the language I speak, and I think how I usually hear the language spoken, the primary sense is the latter and the former would be something secondary. For example, being a wallflower at the high school dance doesn't imply nerddom. But I think my main point is -- if one accepts the latter sense as the primary one, then the notion that the former sense should follow is dealing in stereotypes and pejoratives -- and that's what I'm resisting.
Great write up, Rex. I too stared a long time at NINETIESKID and thought 'What the heck is that?' I'm with OFL, don't believe this is a thing anymore than any other decade.
ReplyDeleteI probably had not seen that No Rain video in twenty years, and now it has popped up twice in a period of eight hours. Last night it came up as a YouTube suggestion for me, and now in Rex's column.
ReplyDeleteA theme that just didn't do anything for me. The issues is none of the '+' words quite mean 'plus' to me.
My issue as well. In particular, KNOT and PIN don't mean "plus/fuse/join" to me in a way that feels very solid.
DeleteI think "eighties/nineties kid" is a pretty common phrase. I don't think it's strange. The Top Ten hit "I Love It" from 2012 by Icona Pop has the phrase, "I'm a nineties bitch," which I feel was a takeoff on "nineties kid," so the phrase has been around for a while.
@kitshef 7:26 am, fun fact: '+' has many uses; eg in computer programming its action depends on the type of data it is operating on. For numbers, it means "add". But for strings (text) it means "concatenate" (join)... exactly its usage here!
DeleteThat's a nice take, @okanaganer.
DeleteA debut with Jeff Chen as a co-constructor? You could tell this was the case 5 clues in. Look….I really appreciate what Jeff does and I want to be encouraging of new constructors…but it’s turning into a trope at this point that the end result of this combo is just going to be dreadful. There’s just nothing fresh at all about this puzzle nor has there been the last 5 times Jeff collaborated with someone new. Move on, please, NYT. There are so many fresh voices applying with puzzles. That this one and most of the other JC+debut puzzles make it in just leads me to think that they’re more interested in running Jeff’s count up and derisking new constructors with a seasoned byline than than they are in finding new people.
ReplyDeleteWordnerd me loved coming across in-the-language phrases made up of three unrelated words patched together like TOO+KNOT+ICE.
ReplyDeleteRiddle loving me loved filling in the outer two words (such as TOO and ICE), which were fairly easy to get in this puzzle, then trying to figure out what that middle word is.
Accomplishment loving me wowed at seeing that the four grayed words were connected. This could not have been an easy answer set to come by.
Acts-of-kindness loving me beamed at Jeff Chen’s once again taking an unpublished constructor, and guiding them into a NYT-published puzzle.
Serendipity loving me enjoyed learning CARAMEL DELITE, then being further reminded of cookies when I came across ANIMAL and Hydrox-sounding HYDRA, not to mention getting an extra boost of sweetness with NERDS.
Thus, many lovely pings in the grid today for me, and thank you both. Congratulations on your debut, Stephan!
I bought a package of Animal Crackers once but had to throw it away. It said on the box: "Do not eat if the seal is broken." So I opened it and, sure enough, the elephant was fine, the giraffe was fine, but the seal was broken. Had to toss it.
DeleteHard for me, and I had to cheate on the HEN / INN crossing - that N was my last entry and I had no idea of either word. Other words came with crosses but it was no fun.
ReplyDeleteHey All !
ReplyDeleteThis puz had me in KNOTs! I couldn't PIN it down! Needed James BOND sporting a TIE to help. Maybe a Spock mind MELD?
Actually, it wasn't that tough, but if I said that initially, my feeble attempt at humor wouldn't have worked. 😁
Different kind of idea. Neat to get real things in the complete answers. Liked the open corners. Cool seeing I.M.PEI, it's been a minute. I had him in a puz of mine once, convenient letters.
Fell into the ussr-CCCP trap. However, NTH clue didn't fool me. Ha! The ole brain kept transmogrifying the Three squared clue into thinking of Three cubed, I was like "twenty seven doesn't fit!" Silly brain.
Have a great Thursday!
No F's - OOH, I LOSE
RooMonster
DarrinV
It's been rare, but satisfying, in the RP Ratings Era when my prediction of his assessment is correct. That happened today, and the write-up was "right on" (as we sixties kids said).
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of the sixties, Jeopardy was much better when it ran (weekdays!) in the sixties and early seventies, with Art Fleming as host.
As for the puzzle, I've got higher expectations for a Thursday. Finished in half our average time and then wondered "did I miss the revealer?", scrutinized the completed grid, looked at the shaded squares, and went "oh".
I guess just enough longish fill (though not a fan of CRANKS IT...as in "crank it up"?) to warrant the second star.
Hmmm. I dunno about 16A. When I took my ORALs, I was seen for two solid hours by three sets of eyes staring at me non-stop, only occasionally looking down slightly to make a (near panic-inducing) note.
ReplyDeleteAnd maybe it's just me, but when I think of CORRODED, I think of a lotta rusty. Not just "a little." But feel free look down slightly and note my error.
Commiserations to Eli -- I lost on a very similar mistake in my appearance (said "the" instead of "a"). Great job though!
ReplyDeleteI’m not sure what to say about this puzzle because I apparently finished it in PB time and my only misstep was putting “shake” instead of CEDAR at 1a. So, given I’m not a puzzle whiz, maybe it’s too easy for a Thursday? I will say I used the themer clues to help solve, but was a little stymied by CARAMELDELITE…never heard of it, but as long as no nuts are involved caramel is a delight. (btw, I like nuts…just not in candy).
ReplyDeleteI guess I will say I liked it more than Rex but think it should have been a Tuesday or Wednesday.
Sometimes I feel like a nut, sometimes I don't. Generally I don't. (But I make an exception for PayDay.) In ice cream, too, I generally prefer a nut-free experience.
DeleteI don't recognize CARA(MELD)ELITE either, but if it's the same thing as a Samoa, then I'm all in. Part of me wants to help @Southside Johnny out: if he's worried about his candy being too old, then I'd almost assuredly be happy to take the hit for him.
My family got tired of hanging with me in the hospital. I heard my granddaughter tell a friend that she had to CRANKSIT.
ReplyDeleteI know a guy who's so old that women who see him socially are said to CARBONDATE him. These days he's suffering from a bad case of non-stationary red-wine induced joint pain, or CREEPINGOUT. Back in the day, he wanted so much to be part of the INSET that he went to Hawaii. People told him he needed to look like a weightlifter to attract girls on the beach, so he took ASTEROID.
I agree that this is an interesting concept that needed more development, but it's always great to have a "different" idea. Thanks, Stephan Prock and Jeff Chen and congrats to Stephanie on the debut.
@egsfor breakfast. You’re truly in fine form today. Particularly like your use of “carbondate.”
DeleteThursday record for me, 13 min.
ReplyDeleteSeems Jeff Chin is continuing to be a kind of pre-Shortz filter/coach. In this case made for an interesting melange of style. I thought the themers were nifty. But overall there were an unusual (for a Thursday) assortment of literal clues, borderline PPP, and legendary crosswordese. On balance, enjoyed sussing out the themers.
ReplyDeleteHad trouble getting started in that I am of course familiar with CEDAR shingle roofs I would not say"Hey, a CEDAR roof" . I know it's technically correct, it just sounds odd to me. So I went elsewhere, winding up in the SE, where CAR and ATE were obvious. Took a while to see that the other + signs were synonyms for connecting things. Guess I didn't have my A game this morning.
ReplyDeleteNames and some funky cluing added to the difficulty level. Took forever to remember Ms. ODAY, ditto for TILDA.. Didn't know MARA at all, nor have O ever heard of a CARAMELDELITE, and NINETIESKID? That's a something? And of course I know AGRA, but Utar Pradesh? Uh, no. Learned something at least.
So so-so for me, SP and JC. Some Peaks, Just Couldn't really get into this one. Thanks for a skosh of fun.
What Rec said, pretty much. I’ll comment more later, no time now.
ReplyDeleteRight up my alley today. I didn’t even mind all of the trivia because of my enjoyment of the theme. I think Thursday is my favorite day of the puzzle week.
ReplyDeleteTo use a term a NINETIES KID might use, I'd describe this puzzle as "meh." The theme wasn't sparkly or fun, and I missed there being a revealer, not because I needed it to solve the puzzle, but because the whole thing fell flat without it.
ReplyDeleteThat said, I didn't mind the fill, and I had no quibbles with any of the cluing. It was all just a little too easy. I liked "Clutch producer" for HEN and "Noggin" for MELON. I just wanted more of a challenge and more smiles on a Thursday.
With yesterday's Yoda theme in my head, I read the first theme answer as TOOK NOT ICE, lol
ReplyDeleteI wished that the squares for the "plus" words hadn't been grayed out, in order to make things a little tougher. I thought the clearly defined segments of the theme phrases made it too easy to enter the first and third as clued, then let the crosses take care of the middle one.
ReplyDeleteOtherwise....I liked the long Downs, and GIRLS prompted me to look again at the grid to see who was there: ELOISE, NANA, TILDA, Anita O'DAY, SHEENA, Rooney MARA, and, deserving of special mention for her clue, the HEN.
Too many obscure proper nouns. Theme was okay.
ReplyDeleteAs far as all the theme words go—KNOT, TIE, MELD, PIN, BOND—they are all ways one can bring parts together to make them into a whole, so I think they go together just fine, And presenting them in five phrases made up of stand-alone words on either side of those theme words is a pretty impressive accomplishment, when you think about it. The puzzle just needed more zing somehow.
ReplyDelete"Girls! Girls! Girls!" features the catchy song "Return to Sender." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZmUfUBqE-s&list=RDLZmUfUBqE-s&start_radio=1
ReplyDeleteRex, Neil Cavuto left Fox a year ago
ReplyDeleteI really wish “Nedds” were a thing, so I could use the other noted name for a clown
ReplyDeleteAgree easier than most Thursdays. For me played as a themeless. except for CARBON DATE which had real zing.
ReplyDeleteFilled the grid successfully but still have no idea what’s going on with the theme. Is that + sign supposed to mean KNOT, TIE, MELD, PIN, and BOND? I read it as “and” or “plus” so it doesn't quite work foor me.
ReplyDeleteSolved easily as a themeless.
Yep, easy. Catching the theme EARLY was helpful.
ReplyDeleteNo WOEs and SHElia before SHEENA (I knew better but momentarily blanked) and BEaT before BEST were it for costly erasures.
I mostly agree with @Rex on this one.
RP: Thanks for the info on Eli. I watched the show but did not realize that’s who he was. As a couch contestant, I seldom keep up with the pace either, but I do occasionally learn something that helps me crack a crossword. Happy to see you are bringing back the holiday pet pics. Can’t wait.
ReplyDeleteLike yesterday, the puzzle was easy with a few too many names. And had it run yesterday, it would’ve been a perfectly nice Wednesday. Not the puzzle’s fault of course, but I felt the simplicity of the theme concept was too elementary for a Thursday. A word plus a word with a word in between. Yes, those three words form a “connected“ phrase which stands alone. And this puzzle is fine standing alone, just a little mundane for what’s supposed to be the trickiest day of the week.
I thought today's puzzle was different, interesting AND fun. If any of you had ever taught -- at the college level or high school level, any class with "90s kids"
ReplyDeleteyou would know in a heartbeat what it means. "Judge not, etc."
I have to admit, I’ve been looking forward to the holiday pet pics for months! They’ve definitely become an indispensable holiday tradition.
ReplyDeleteEli was on fire and then his nemesis found both Daily Doubles in the double Jeopardy round. Tough break for someone who came within inches of reaching the title after fifteen years of perseverance. Congratulations, a great achievement.
ReplyDeleteDid I forget to say "Thank you for bringing back the XMAS Pet Pic Parade????"
ReplyDeleteRex rarely has something good to say about a Jeff Chen work. I'm guessing that Chen was asked to help Prock, who had come up with the theme. Chen turned it into something smooth and professional. I liked it very much.
ReplyDeleteThis is more of a Tuesday puzzle; on Thursday I look forward to a bit more trickiness. But I'm perfectly okay with '+' meaning "join", unlike many others.
ReplyDeleteThere used to be a lot of CEDAR roofs in this part of the world, but hardly any in the last few decades, probably because of fire rating, cost, durability. I'd have a hard time finding one in our town.
I'm wondering what Gary's Gunk Gauge will be today... seems a little better than recently.
Weird-ish puztheme. Well, at least this ThursPuz had a bit of Skill + Character, also known as: ? *
ReplyDeletestaff weeject picks: PIN & TIE. Potent little puztheme joints.
fave thing: CRANK SIT. Shoulda been clued as: {What someone would need to do with M&A, while his whole family is out of town?}. Otherwise, he's apt to submit another real weird puz to the NYT, like he just did recently.
honrable mention to ASTEROID & its clue.
Thanx for gangin up on us, Mr. Prock & Chenmeister dudes. And congratz to Stephan P. on his half-debut.
Masked & Anonymo3Us
p.s. * = ARTLINKLETTER, of course.
... and now, for a sorta like-able dessert puz ...
"Likely Stories" - 8x7 12 min. themed runt puzzle:
**gruntz**
M&A
Don we now our gay apparel !
ReplyDeleteDef the best time of yr on the Dino Blog - always look forward to the various holiday pet pics
Had slate or shale before cedar also
As for 20 A - plural does not work - one at a time on the (singular) rim plz - have you seen the size of an avg NBAer - one’s enough to bring down the whole shebang (think Joker, AD, Greek Freak etc)
I enjoy Jeopardy
ReplyDelete